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Ardanielmoderator
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Dec-31-07, 01:11 PM (EST)
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"Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
 
   LAST EDITED ON Dec-31-07 AT 01:11 PM (EST)
 
http://www.thexaxis.com/astonishingxmen/2007.htm

Paul O'Brien of The X-Axis is one of my favorite comics critics, mostly because he's not very much of a critic at all; he's an ordinary Brit with a bone to pick with the current Marvel X-book administration. The results are both wryly amusing and deeply incisive-- if you're looking to start your own comics company, you could do worse than take O'Brien's critiques of Marvel editorial policy and advertising strategy seriously.

This article covers the dire progress of Astonishing X-Men this year-- Whedon's two-year plotline is lurching into Year Four as we speak, with an end dimly in sight. Marvel's opted to put out a Giant-Size Astonishing X-Men one-shot after issue 24..

...which won't bring us any new storyline, any Annual-style one-shot, nothing like that. No, it's basically Astonishing X-Men #25, by Joss Whedon, only twice as goddamned long. Why? Because Marvel can, apparently, and Whedon's figured out some way to extend his AXM paycheck.

Does anyone actually *really dig* this book at this point in time? I loved the first six issues, unreservedly...

...in 2004. It's now pretty much 2008, and while I'm really into the quirky-ass relationship between Agent Brand and Hank, the rest of this book can go fuck itself. The whole "the inexplicably sentient Danger Room is totally pissed off now!" plotline was unmitigated garbage, just with better one-liners than Jeph Loeb would've given it. The release dates are atrocious, and Whedon basically *has no excuse* at this point in time-- the excuse that was given in 2005 had to do with Wonder Woman, and Whedon's not even *on* that project any more. The WGA is on strike, so the new Eliza Dushku show isn't going anywhere until that gets sorted out. He can *get off his ass and finish the damn book already,* and put it out of its plodding, Sorkin-esque misery.

Shit, Whedon's not even writing Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Joss Whedon's Season Eight for Dark Horse, despite having *shoved his name into the subtitle* after issue #6. He handed it off to Brian K. Vaughan, whose work I happen to love, and then to Brad "What The Fuck, Dude" Meltzer. I see Jeph Loeb is working on a plot arc for it as well. That's... yeah, whatever. I have nothing to add, other than that if you're a Buffy comic fan, maybe you should be asking Dark Horse's Scott Allie why you've been bait-and-switched, at least until the Jane Espenson arc starts. Probably sometime near the Mayan apocalypse.

Whedon's establishing a comics rep as a guy who doesn't want to work on the projects he's given, except reluctantly and very slowly. Astonishing is slated to be taken over by Warren Ellis and Simone Bianchi next year-- and Ellis doesn't have a reputation as a writer who submits his scripts in a timely fashion, either. I like Ellis's work, but I've given up on expecting consistency past the first three to six issues of anything he writes, and I know he'll never go more than 12 issues on anything I really like from him.

(Is the end of Planetary out yet? Anyone? Did anyone else just get the first two TPBs of that and then give up, resigned to picking up the others during the same Mayan apocalypse that will produce a Mutant Enemy writer actually writing for Buffy the Vampire Slayer: It's Really Joss Whedon's Season Eight, Even Though It's Not?)

Meanwhile, Ed Brubaker continues to turn out largely-timely issues of Uncanny X-Men, Criminal, Captain America, Immortal Iron Fist, and the like. (Say what you will about killing Steve Rogers. I'm not interested in his content here, just in the fact that he cranks out work that's both commercially viable *and* timely.)

Matt Fraction kicks out Casanova, the other half of Immortal Iron Fist, The Order, and Punisher War Journal on a regular basis, without excuses, *and* he's picking up an X-book in 2008 (per Rich Johnston). Before coming to comics full-time, he was working in comics *and* in music video production, a job that doesn't leave most people with enough time for a *life,* never mind a second career.

Brian Wood was *holding down a full-time staff job on the Grand Theft Auto series at Rockstar* while turning out The Couriers, Couscous Express, Fight for Tomorrow, and Pounded. Now that he's full-time comics guy, we get an issue of DMZ and Northlanders every time we're supposed to, he just finished up Local, and he's still working on graphic novels.

These guys apparently have a work ethic, and a damn good one. I wish Whedon had learned the virtues of one before he embarked on Astonishing, and I hope Ellis learns to temper his prodigious talent with some respect for the editorial process and the folks he reports to when he takes up the reins.


(NB: God bless Jeph Loeb-- he's been through a lot of really awful shit in the last decade-- but he needs to retire again. Comics doesn't need two of Modern-Era Chris Claremont, a guy with a lot of personal baggage that seeps into all his current product. I'm not a big fan of Whedon's comics work, obviously, but Whedon probably has never written a story where Wolverine was descended from *mutant wolverines;* Loeb has, and that's indicative of a need to find a new hobby.)


Ard Sumhenner
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? Mephronteam Dec-31-07 1
     RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? Ardanielmoderator Dec-31-07 2
         RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? Slartiteam Dec-31-07 3
             RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? Ardanielmoderator Dec-31-07 4
         RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? mdg1 Dec-31-07 6
  RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? Ardanielmoderator Dec-31-07 5
     RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now? BZArcher Dec-31-07 7

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Mephronteam
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Dec-31-07, 03:24 PM (EST)
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1. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #0
 
   Re: Astonishing

The fact that in #23 they showed that the past four issues, with a bunch of people acting so tremendously OOC that you were wondering if the book was all done by Mastermind, were actually a massive feint, was a payoff. But after #24 comes out, I am done with Marvel. Joey the Cheesebrain's recent squat-and-crap on Spider-Man has finished the nail in the coffin started with the death of Steve Rogers.

I'm also reminded: have we seen anything in Mighty Avengers recently that indicates we might get a new issue soon?

not that DC is without it's screwups - for the love of all that's holy, get a solid goddamn team on the Wildstorm properties and get them timely. (Gene Ha on 'The Authority': "There is no #3 script, there may never be a #3 script." Grant Morrison, stop fucking around please.)

I dunno. I'd like to see something high-profile, on time, and generally good. You got that in Ed Brubaker's Captain America - say what you will, he had the balls to break one of the Believed Unbreakable Rules, and he did it pretty damn well and set a lot of very interesting things up.

The one hope I have is with the new story arc in Robin - they may be redeeming Leslie Thompkins and bringing back Stephanie 'Spoiler' Brown.

(and as far as the Wolverine thing is concerned, one of the more 'dude what the HELL' moments of X-Men history was that Len Wein, had he gotten to use Wolverine more, would have revealed that he was an actual wolverine mutated to humanity by the High Evolutionary, who did funky stuff like that. Maybe that was where Jeph Loeb got the idea. But yeah, he needs some time off.)

--
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Ardanielmoderator
Member since Mar-31-03
248 posts
Dec-31-07, 04:25 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #1
 
   >Re: Astonishing
>
>But after #24 comes out, I am done with Marvel. Joey
>the Cheesebrain's recent squat-and-crap on Spider-Man has finished the
>nail in the coffin started with the death of Steve Rogers.

"One More Day" is a separate issue here. It probably deserves its own thread. As I said to one of my college pals the other day, I stopped reading Spider-Man during the MacFarlane administration and have never really regretted it. If you want quirky, quippy Spidey action, you want Bendis's Ultimate Spider-Man-- which, admittedly, has lost 10,000 readers since Bagley left the book, but, still, it's Bendis and it's Pete and it's not bogged in Mephisto bullshit.

(Paul O'Brien, for those of you who don't follow comics, also analyzes Marvel's sales figures every month or so. I have the November 2007 ones in front of me as I type.)

>I'm also reminded: have we seen anything in Mighty Avengers recently
>that indicates we might get a new issue soon?

Fucked if I know, I don't read any of the Avengers books. :)

>not that DC is without it's screwups - for the love of all that's
>holy, get a solid goddamn team on the Wildstorm properties and get
>them timely. (Gene Ha on 'The Authority': "There is no #3 script,
>there may never be a #3 script." Grant Morrison, stop fucking around
>please.)

Christos Gage appears to be the Designated Wildstorm Savior at the moment, as Friday's Comic Shop News lead story revealed. He's out to crash the Carrier, make the Night Tribes the undisputed lords of Eastern Europe, and otherwise reboot the status quo.

I really liked Gage on Marvel's weird, quirky, poor-selling Union Jack mini-- like Paul Cornell, he operates well in unusual, small-market situations. I'm hoping he does some good stuff for Wildstorm, not that I'm reading those books.

>I dunno. I'd like to see something high-profile, on time, and
>generally good.

Sadly, The Order's likely to be cancelled next year sometime-- sub-30K sales on an Initiative title can't be good, for as fucking fascinating and quirky as the title is. *I* like it, really I do, but it is a hard book to *love,* given that it's largely a perverse take on team dynamics. (None of the Morituri stuff has appeared, btw-- no one appears to be headed for certain death by issue 12, for instance.) I also know that it's not high-profile.

Ultimates 3 is a complete Loeb-turd. I have very little hope for the Ultimate books when Ultimatum starts in the spring. Kirkman's leaving Ultimate X-Men with 93, which makes me wonder who the hell is taking over and what they'll do with the goddamn mess of 1990s 616 plotlines he's created.

Punisher War Journal remains relevant to Initiative continuity, features the goddamn Punisher, and is brilliant, but it's lost 60% of its audience over the first 10 issues per these here sales figures. I don't know what the deal is there.

There are a bunch of X-Men reboots going on this year, too. The Carey X-Men is becoming X-Men Legacy. New X-Men is over and Kyle and Yost are moving on to kill half the fucking universe in X-Force. Exiles and New Excalibur are both gone in favor of one New Exiles title, and there's a mysterious Young X-Men book that may or may not be Fraction's turf coming up. New Excalibur's being rebooted under Paul Cornell's writing as Some Other Book. Astonishing X-Men: Second Stage is supposed to start sometime, but that may be in 2009 for all I know.

I doubt that *any* of these X-books will be a compelling read. I have some slim hope for Paul Cornell. I don't know that Ellis will be able to hold a schedule-- he's already annoyed me with newuniversal and Desolation Jones, with their screwed-up artist issues and schedule shit, so I don't know that Astonishing will come out often enough or at all to keep my attention.

I see nothing on the horizon for Avengers, and Iron Man's got the movie coming...

...which does nothing to help the fact that in the MU, Iron Man is a *dick,* and dicks do not sell mainstream comics to moviegoing Americans. Marvel should have aggressively moved to put an end to this "Tony Stark, unlikable fascist" bullshit the *minute* Favreau signed on to do the movie, and they didn't, and it's going to bite them in the ass sales-wise. They had a chance to really expand the market for Iron Man and they're not taking it.

>You got that in Ed Brubaker's Captain America - say
>what you will, he had the balls to break one of the Believed
>Unbreakable Rules, and he did it pretty damn well and set a lot of
>very interesting things up.

Brubaker is very good at what he does, with the exception of Vulcan in X-Men, and even then I'm not sure that that's all that it appears to be. Immortal Iron Fist is another one of those books that's quirky and very genre-faithful and a rousing good read. Which means it'll probably be gone after 25 issues.

>The one hope I have is with the new story arc in Robin - they may be
>redeeming Leslie Thompkins and bringing back Stephanie 'Spoiler'
>Brown.

Heh, someone else I was talking to the other day dumped DC entire after DiDio refused to give Brown a memorial, because Girls Couldn't Be Robin....

I can't really speak to DC. I like Green Arrow/ Black Canary and ignore anything else they put out in the mainstream DCU.

>(and as far as the Wolverine thing is concerned, one of the more 'dude
>what the HELL' moments of X-Men history was that Len Wein, had he
>gotten to use Wolverine more, would have revealed that he was an
>actual wolverine mutated to humanity by the High Evolutionary, who did
>funky stuff like that. Maybe that was where Jeph Loeb got the idea.
>But yeah, he needs some time off.)

Loeb's story, to be fair, uses mutant *wolves,* not wolverines. I got that bit wrong.

But, you know, *wolves do not improve the overall issue here.*

Ard Sumhenner
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace


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Slartiteam
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Dec-31-07, 04:53 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #2
 
   >>Re: Astonishing
>>
>>I'm also reminded: have we seen anything in Mighty Avengers recently
>>that indicates we might get a new issue soon?
>Fucked if I know, I don't read any of the Avengers books. :)

MA #6 finally shipped, thus ending Frank Cho's regular involvement in the series, which, AIUI, is the main cause of the series' delays. Marvel's website claims 9 January for #7, which would cover the Venom virus storyline that got recapped in an issue of New Avengers in order to set up what that series is doing with The Hood.

>>holy, get a solid goddamn team on the Wildstorm properties and get
>Christos Gage appears to be the Designated Wildstorm Savior at the

I've been reading some of the work he's been doing, such as post-Ennis Midnighter and the recently-ended Stormwatch PHD, and rather enjoying it.

>>You got that in Ed Brubaker's Captain America - say
>>what you will, he had the balls to break one of the Believed

I've been reading Bru's Cap, and finding it surprisingly enjoyable, even with no actual Captain America in it. I continue to be shocked that I actually like the whole Bucky/Winter Soldier thing.

>>The one hope I have is with the new story arc in Robin - they may be
>>redeeming Leslie Thompkins and bringing back Stephanie 'Spoiler'
>>Brown.

By which I should hope they mean that Steph never died and she and Leslie had some sekrit purpose that required faking the death and Leslie's culpability in it. "She was dead but now she's alive again" neither absolves nor necessarily redeems Leslie.

>Heh, someone else I was talking to the other day dumped DC entire
>after DiDio refused to give Brown a memorial, because Girls Couldn't
>Be Robin....

That's also astoundingly annoying, along with the rest of Didio's tendencies towards o'erweening smugness.

>I can't really speak to DC. I like Green Arrow/ Black Canary and
>ignore anything else they put out in the mainstream DCU.

Although if what happened at the end of the last issue actually sticks, I'm probably pretty much done with that. That was both cheap and randomly gratuitous.

--
Chris "Slarti" Pinard - Just zis guy, ya know?
Who are you? What do you want? Why are you here?


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Ardanielmoderator
Member since Mar-31-03
248 posts
Dec-31-07, 04:57 PM (EST)
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4. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #3
 
   >>Christos Gage appears to be the Designated Wildstorm Savior...
>
>I've been reading some of the work he's been doing, such as post-Ennis
>Midnighter and the recently-ended Stormwatch PHD, and rather enjoying
>it.

Gage has a good handle on the odd-couple teams. (Union Jack was teamed up with *Sabra* in that book, and there was some shit about Batroc the Leaper, and, gee, it was all a great breezy superhero read, actually.) He's preferable, in Marvel's B/C-list bullpen, to Daniel fucking Way.

Speaking of guys named Way, I have an insane love for Dark Horse's Umbrella Academy-- and I *hate* My Chemical Romance, so I shouldn't, by rights, like a comic by its lead singer and primary lyricist. But, there it is. Umbrella Academy is fun, and the art is great, and you should all at least give it a look-see.

>>I can't really speak to DC. I like Green Arrow/ Black Canary and
>>ignore anything else they put out in the mainstream DCU.
>
>Although if what happened at the end of the last issue actually
>sticks, I'm probably pretty much done with that. That was both cheap
>and randomly gratuitous.

So was what happened at the end of the Wedding Special. I've never known Winick to express any particular annoyance with that one character, so I'm crossing my fingers. For all I know, there's an Earth-2 version of that character just off-panel to the left there.

Ard Sumhenner
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace


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mdg1
Member since Aug-25-04
357 posts
Dec-31-07, 05:54 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #2
 
  
>Brubaker is very good at what he does, with the exception of Vulcan in
>X-Men, and even then I'm not sure that that's all that it appears to
>be. Immortal Iron Fist is another one of those books that's quirky
>and very genre-faithful and a rousing good read. Which means it'll
>probably be gone after 25 issues.

I'm rapidly regressing into an Iron Fist fanboy... it's just plain fun comics, without any of the whole Civil War baggage. I'll ride it as long as it lasts....

Mario


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Ardanielmoderator
Member since Mar-31-03
248 posts
Dec-31-07, 05:31 PM (EST)
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5. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #0
 
   Also, as it is relevant to the Work Ethic discussion:

http://www.antonyjohnston.com/gtw/

Antony Johnston, author of Oni Press's Wasteland and Image's adorable Texas Strangers, discusses how he applies Getting Things Done's operative ideologies to the process of writing comics.

Love or hate GTD-- I don't use it myself and I'm amused that the founder has a somewhat shady cult-involved past-- you don't often get this sort of look into a working comics creator's bag of tricks.

Johnston is also writing a manga-style Wolverine book for Del Rey Manga under the new deal with Marvel, too, which should be interesting.

(Raina Telgemeier and Dave Roman are writing the X-Men title for that, which is... apparently... sort of a Fruits Basket Meets the X-Men thing, where Kitty is the only female student at Xavier's and everything is very shoujo. I dunno what I can say to that. Raina and Dave are good writers. I expect it to be good manga. I'm not sure the X-Men are the right vehicles for that.)

Ard Sumhenner
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace


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BZArcher
Member since Nov-8-05
214 posts
Dec-31-07, 05:55 PM (EST)
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7. "RE: Whedon Fans: Where Is Your God Now?"
In response to message #5
 
   But Logan-sama is so Kawaiiiiiiiiii!

^_^

(Please, god, kill me.)

---------------------------
Hope Rides Alone


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