48||0|2613|5|yes
0|0|0|||1||Iron Man|Gryphon||23:59:08|05/01/2008|I have%2C in practical terms%2C been waiting for an Iron Man feature film since %5Blink%3Awww.comics.org%2Fdetails.lasso%3Fid%3D36672%7C1982%5D.  I have had some very detailed mental pictures of how this film should look and feel.%0D%0A%0D%0AIt has now been made.%0D%0A%0D%0A%5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D may be the best live-action comic book movie made to date.  It%27s certainly the best since Burton%27s %5Bi%5DBatman%5B%2Fi%5D.  %28Yes%2C I%27m including %5Bi%5DSpider-Man%5B%2Fi%5D in that tabulation.  I enjoyed %5Bi%5DSpider-Man%5B%2Fi%5D quite a lot%2C and have no %5Bi%5Dcomplaints%5B%2Fi%5D about it - which is quite an achievement%2C when you consider how consistently disappointing comic book movies have historically tended to be - but it just doesn%27t have the same iconic status in my comics hindbrain as %5Bi%5DBatman%5B%2Fi%5D.  Sue me.%29%0D%0A%0D%0AI%27ll be seeing it again.%0D%0A%0D%0AFuck it%2C who am I kidding%3F  If any single movie ever motivates me to actually buy a Blu-Ray deck and a TV that can display what it%27s pushing%2C it%27ll be %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
1|1|0|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Polychrome||00:20:50|05/02/2008|[updated:LAST EDITED ON May-02-08 AT 00:23 AM (EDT)]Impressive. I had heard that many critics were positive on it%2C but critics%27 opinions should always be taken with salt. I%27m glad to hear you liked it%2C and I%27ll probably catch the noon matinee tomorrow. Edit%3A Wow%2C showtimes start at 10am.%0D%0ARumor has it they%27re already planning the sequel which supposedly will be %5Bi%5DDemon in the Bottle%5B%2Fi%5D. Which would be impressive if true.%0D%0A%0D%0APolychrome%0D%0A
2|2|1|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||00:28:07|05/02/2008|%3ERumor has it they%27re already planning the sequel which supposedly will %0D%0A%3Ebe %5Bi%5DDemon in the Bottle%5B%2Fi%5D. Which would be impressive if true. %0D%0A%0D%0AThere are a couple of fairly broad hints as to %5Bi%5DIron Man II%5B%2Fi%5D%27s general outline in the first film%2C yeah.  And I believe they have outlines in hand for %5Bi%5Dtwo%5B%2Fi%5D sequels - Favreau has made remarks in interviews asking him about bits of the Iron Man canon he left out of the first film to the effect of%2C %22Hey%2C don%27t take my trilogy away.%22%0D%0A%0D%0A%28As for Downey%2C he%27s already joked that he%27s been training to play Tony Stark his whole life%2C and that he%27d happily do 15 Iron Man pictures if they want. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
3|3|2|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Rickdominated||01:45:00|05/02/2008|I have nothing against Iron Man becoming either James Bond or Godzilla%0D%0A%0D%0AA friend of mine is trying to push the idea that Iron Man II might just be a Smokescreen for the inevitable Avengers movie%2C and that last scene is doing nothing to dull his enthusiasm.%0D%0A%0D%0AAnd if II is Demon in a Bottle%2C would that make III Extremis%3F
4|4|3|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||01:50:54|05/02/2008|[updated:LAST EDITED ON May-02-08 AT 01:51 AM (EDT)]%3EAnd if II is Demon in a Bottle%2C would that make III Extremis%3F %0D%0A%0D%0AFuck%2C I hope not.  That would ruin the whole experience for me.  I %5Bb%5Dhated%5B%2Fb%5D %5Bi%5DExtremis%5B%2Fi%5D.  A full frontal latching onto the teat of Warren Ellis%27s cellphone fetish was %5Bi%5Dso very%5B%2Fi%5D not what was needed just then.%0D%0A%0D%0A%28And to be honest%2C I%27m not too wild about the whole %22Marvel Universe film super-franchise%22 thing either%2C given that all the dumbfuckery that%27s dragged Iron Man down for the last 15 years or so in print has been coupled to Avengers or other cross-title bullshit.  I%27m hopeful that if they %5Bi%5Ddo%5B%2Fi%5D make an Avengers film%2C as seems likely%2C they%27ll do it more like back in Stan Lee%27s day%2C and keep the team stuff %5Bi%5Dout%5B%2Fi%5D of the team members%27 %22solo titles%22 except as part of the setting%27s background noise.%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
8|5|4|||||RE%3A Iron Man|mdg1||19:10:35|05/02/2008|Methinks they are more likely to do something like %22Armor Wars%22%2C anyway.
10|3|2|||||RE%3A Iron Man|BLUE||16:29:52|05/03/2008|%3E%28As for Downey%2C he%27s already joked that he%27s been training to play %0D%0A%3ETony Stark his whole life%2C and that he%27d happily do 15 Iron Man %0D%0A%3Epictures if they want. %3A%29 %0D%0A%3E%0D%0AI think that was mentioned in the forums when the movie was first annouced%3B what better casting than to have a womanizing%2C alcoholic billionaire played by a womanizing%2C alcoholic millionaire%3F%0D%0A%0D%0AGoing to go see it now with all my local geek friends.  And to paraphrase Mythbusters%2C %22David wants big boom.%22  I doubt I%27ll be disappointed.
5|1|0|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Meagen||06:14:21|05/02/2008|Saw a bit of marketing hype on the telly. %28I%27m in the UK currently%2C so it%27s %22the telly%22 as opposed to %22TV%22.%29 My favourite bit was when the interviewer asked %22so if you%27re Iron Man%2C does that make you good at ironing%3F%22 to the actor%27s slightly perplexed expression.
6|2|5|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|BlackAeronaut||08:12:28|05/02/2008|Heh-heh.  I can imagine which reporter -that- would be.  %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0ABTW%3A I got lucky and my ship was in port at Hong Kong when the movie came out.  Lucky for me%2C most movies recorded in English just get subtitled in Mandarin here in China. %3AD%0D%0A%0D%0A%5Btable%5D%5Btr%5D%5Btd%5D%5Bhr%5D%5Bfont size%3D%222%22 face%3D%22Arial Narrow%22%5D%5Bb%5DBlack Aeronaut Technologies%5B%2Fb%5D%0D%0ACreative aerospace solutions for the discerning spacer%0D%0A%5Bi%5D%22To the commissary we should go%2C%22 Yoda declared firmly.  %22News of this kind a danish requires.%22%5B%2Fi%5D%5B%2Ffont%5D%5B%2Ftd%5D%5B%2Ftr%5D%5B%2Ftable%5D
7|2|5|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||12:25:14|05/02/2008|%3ESaw a bit of marketing hype on the telly. %28I%27m in the UK currently%2C so %0D%0A%3Eit%27s %22the telly%22 as opposed to %22TV%22.%29 My favourite bit was when the %0D%0A%3Einterviewer asked %22so if you%27re Iron Man%2C does that make you good at %0D%0A%3Eironing%3F%22 to the actor%27s slightly perplexed expression. %0D%0A%0D%0AYears ago%2C in an issue of their self-parody series %5Bi%5DWhat The...%3F%21%5B%2Fi%5D%2C Marvel did a riff on the old %5Bi%5DSpider-Man%5B%2Fi%5D cartoon theme that went something like%3A%0D%0A%0D%0A%5Bi%5DIron Man%2C Iron Man%0D%0ADoes whatever an iron can%0D%0APresses pants really fine%0D%0AKeeps those pleats right in line%0D%0ALook out%21%0D%0AThere goes the Iron Man%5B%2Fi%5D%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
9|3|7|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|BobSchroeck||21:57:45|05/02/2008|%3EYears ago%2C in an issue of their self-parody series %5Bi%5DWhat %0D%0A%3EThe...%3F%21%5B%2Fi%5D%2C Marvel did a riff on the old %5Bi%5DSpider-Man%5B%2Fi%5D cartoon %0D%0A%3Etheme that went something like%3A %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5DIron Man%2C Iron Man %0D%0A%3EDoes whatever an iron can %5B%2Fi%5D%0D%0A%0D%0AWhich then got sung in the film %5Bi%5DBio-Dome%5B%2Fi%5D by Pauly Shore and whatever other mutant he was working with at the time...  which is where I first heard %28of%29 it.  I was quite surprised to learn a couple years back that it actually came out of the comics.%0D%0A%0D%0A-- Bob%0D%0A-------------------%0D%0AI intend to be a freak for the rest of my life%2C and I shall baffle you with cabbages and rhinoceroses in the kitchen and incessant quotations from %5Bi%5DNow We Are Six%5B%2Fi%5D through the mouthpiece of Lord Snooty%27s giant poisoned electric head.  So theeeeeere...
11|4|9|||||RE%3A Iron Man|BLUE||16:45:27|05/03/2008|%3E%3E%5Bi%5DIron Man%2C Iron Man %0D%0A%3E%3EDoes whatever an iron can %5B%2Fi%5D%0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EWhich then got sung in the film %5Bi%5DBio-Dome%5B%2Fi%5D by Pauly Shore and %0D%0A%3Ewhatever other mutant he was working with at the time... %0D%0A%0D%0AThat would be Stephen Baldwin%2C the slackest of the Baldwin brothers.  I have way too much crap in my head...
12|1|0|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Peter Eng||14:09:14|05/05/2008|%3EI have%2C in practical terms%2C been waiting for an Iron Man feature film %0D%0A%3Esince %5Blink%3Awww.comics.org%2Fdetails.lasso%3Fid%3D36672%7C1982%5D.  I have had %0D%0A%3Esome very detailed mental pictures of how this film should look and %0D%0A%3Efeel. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EIt has now been made. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%0D%0ASeconded.  I%27ll agree with the reviewer who complained that some of the scenes felt more like Acme Industries than Stark Industries%2C but other than that%2C there%27s very little to gripe on that can%27t be said of most comic book adaptations.%0D%0A%0D%0APeter Eng%0D%0A--%0D%0ASeriously%2C how does a guy survive that without having Wile E. Coyote enhancements%3F
13|2|12|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||15:14:39|05/05/2008|%3ESeriously%2C how does a guy survive that without having Wile E. Coyote %0D%0A%3Eenhancements%3F %0D%0A%0D%0A%28shrug%29  The film needs a bit of comedy relief there.  Points to Mr. Favreau for recognizing that and finding very effective ways of providing it.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A%22That test flight provided %5Bi%5Dexcellent%5B%2Fi%5D data%2C sir.%22%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
14|3|13|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Matrix Dragon||16:53:35|05/05/2008|%3E%28shrug%29  The film needs a bit of comedy relief there.  Points to Mr. %0D%0A%3EFavreau for recognizing that and finding very effective ways of %0D%0A%3Eproviding it. %0D%0A%0D%0A%22If you spray me again%2C and I%27m not on fire%2C I%27m giving you to a community college.%22%0D%0A%0D%0AThe robots are adorable. That%27s enough reason for the scenes there. Plus%2C it made sure the viewers knew just how smart the robots were for their save later on.%0D%0A%0D%0AMatrix Dragon%2C J. Random Nutter
15|4|14|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||17:03:40|05/05/2008|%3EThe robots are adorable. That%27s enough reason for the scenes there.%0D%0A%0D%0A%22I%27m sorry%2C am I in your way%3F%22%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
17|5|15|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|BobSchroeck||22:39:10|05/05/2008|%3E%3EThe robots are adorable. That%27s enough reason for the scenes there.%0D%0A%3E%22I%27m sorry%2C am I in your way%3F%22 %0D%0A%0D%0AWaht just makes it better is%2C as I realized the next morning after seeing the film%2C that they are his %5Bi%5Dfirst%5B%2Fi%5D robots%2C the ones he%27s shown with in the news clippings and photos during the %22tribute%22 at the beginning of the film.  They%27re not there because they%27re useful%2C they%27re there because they have sentimental value and are practically pets.  The fact that they %5Bi%5Dcan%5B%2Fi%5D be useful is just gravy for Tony...%0D%0A%0D%0A-- Bob%0D%0A-------------------%0D%0AI intend to be a freak for the rest of my life%2C and I shall baffle you with cabbages and rhinoceroses in the kitchen and incessant quotations from %5Bi%5DNow We Are Six%5B%2Fi%5D through the mouthpiece of Lord Snooty%27s giant poisoned electric head.  So theeeeeere...
18|6|17|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||23:06:35|05/05/2008|%3EThe fact that they %5Bi%5Dcan%5B%2Fi%5D be useful is just gravy for %0D%0A%3ETony... %0D%0A%0D%0AAnd yet he claims to be uninterested in keeping old junk.  %28I%27m hoping that was wrong%2C if only because I hope %5Bi%5DIron Man II%5B%2Fi%5D has a version of the classic %22Hall of Iron Men%22 shot that turned up in the comics from time to time.  I%27d like to think they were setting that up by arranging for Mr. Clunky to wind up back at Stark Industries even though Tony abandoned it in the desert.%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A%22... I thought it%27d be %5Bi%5Dbigger%5B%2Fi%5D.%22%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
19|7|18|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|BobSchroeck||21:10:32|05/06/2008|%3EAnd yet he claims to be uninterested in keeping old junk.%0D%0A%0D%0AI suspect that was him being contrary for the sake of being contrary.%0D%0A%0D%0A-- Bob%0D%0A-------------------%0D%0AI intend to be a freak for the rest of my life%2C and I shall baffle you with cabbages and rhinoceroses in the kitchen and incessant quotations from %5Bi%5DNow We Are Six%5B%2Fi%5D through the mouthpiece of Lord Snooty%27s giant poisoned electric head.  So theeeeeere...
16|2|12|||||RE%3A Iron Man|BLUE||21:10:53|05/05/2008|%3ESeconded.  I%27ll agree with the reviewer who complained that some of %0D%0A%3Ethe scenes felt more like Acme Industries than Stark Industries%2C but %0D%0A%3Eother than that%2C there%27s very little to gripe on that can%27t be said of %0D%0A%3Emost comic book adaptations. %0D%0A%0D%0AI agree with you there.  Personally%2C my favorite bit was where he%27s hovering over the house and has Jarvis turn the jets off%2C with resulting property damage.%0D%0A%0D%0AAnd if it wasn%27t good enough%2C it had Samuel L. Jackson in a cameo%21  I won%27t say that nothing done by Samuel L. can be bad%2C because%2C well%2C look at %5Bi%5DSnakes on a Plane%5B%2Fi%5D %28although there is much campy comedic value there%29%2C but anything good with him is suddenly %5Bi%5Dbetter%5B%2Fi%5D.
20|3|16|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Peter Eng||15:46:58|05/07/2008|%3E%3ESeconded.  I%27ll agree with the reviewer who complained that some of %0D%0A%3E%3Ethe scenes felt more like Acme Industries than Stark Industries%2C but %0D%0A%3E%3Eother than that%2C there%27s very little to gripe on that can%27t be said of %0D%0A%3E%3Emost comic book adaptations. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EI agree with you there.  Personally%2C my favorite bit was where he%27s %0D%0A%3Ehovering over the house and has Jarvis turn the jets off%2C with %0D%0A%3Eresulting property damage. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%0D%0AThat worked for me%2C as well.  The first test-fire of the boot jets%2C on the other hand%2C felt a bit out of line to me.  I think it could have been played for comedy without going into a %22that should have sidelined him for a month%22 moment.%0D%0A%0D%0AAnd yes%2C SLJ does improve on things.%0D%0A%0D%0APeter Eng%0D%0A--%0D%0AThou sayest thou dost hail from distant What%21%0D%0AI know but naught of thy strange country What.%0D%0AWhat language speak they in the land of What%3F%0D%0A%0D%0A%28from pulpbard.wikispaces.com%29
21|3|16|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||17:10:10|05/07/2008|%3EAnd if it wasn%27t good enough%2C it had Samuel L. Jackson in a cameo%21%0D%0A%0D%0AYeah%2C uh... I%27m probably revealing myself to be terminally uncool here %28as if that hadn%27t been obvious for years anyway%29%2C but I wasn%27t too sanguine about that whole stinger.  There are several reasons for that.  None specifically have to do with Mr. Jackson himself%2C and all are based more on conjecture than solid information %28because we don%27t have any of the latter yet%29%2C but still... I have reservations.%0D%0A%0D%0A1%29 Since when was Nick Fury black%3F  This isn%27t a racial thing%2C it%27s a continuity thing.  Col. Fury - formerly Sgt. Fury of Howling Commandos fame - is a World War II veteran.  It %28and his connection to an offshoot of Operation Rebirth%29 gives him his shared history with Captain America.  Vaguely important%2C I would%27ve thought.  And you didn%27t find many black commando team leaders in World War II.  They seem to have just abandoned this bit of the character%27s origin entirely and gone with the Ultimate Marvel version%2C which brings us to%0D%0A%0D%0A2%29 The inclusion of %5Bi%5Danything%5B%2Fi%5D giving the movie universe they%27re developing any overtones of Ultimate Marvel isn%27t going to float my boat.  I%27m pretty much instinctively repelled by anything to do with that imprint - with the admittedly odd exception of its original title%2C %5Bi%5DUltimate Spider-Man%5B%2Fi%5D%2C which I liked enough to buy the first of the big Barnes %26 Noble hardback collections %28this in spite of the fact that I%27ve never read anything else by Brian Bendis that doesn%27t make me want to punch someone%2C preferably Brian Bendis%29.  The dubious honor of %5Bi%5Dtopping%5B%2Fi%5D my %22Ultimate Marvel Things that Suck%22 list goes to %5Bi%5DThe Ultimates%5B%2Fi%5D%2C which brings us to%0D%0A%0D%0A3%29 %22I%27m here to talk to you about the Avenger Initiative.%22  Oh %5Bi%5Ddear.%5B%2Fi%5D  This has the potential to bode ill on %5Bi%5Dso%5B%2Fi%5D many levels.  Let%27s look at the first part first%3A%0D%0A%0D%0AA%29 I know now%2C since Marvel announced it the other day%2C that they%27re doing an Avengers movie%2C which this is obviously part of the build-up to%2C and this makes me uneasy - for the simple reason that almost all of the grinding lameassery that%27s made %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D such a chore to be pleased with over the last... what%2C jeez%2C 15 years or so%3F - starting with %5Bi%5DThe Crossing%5B%2Fi%5D and continuing%2C with occasional respites like Kurt Busiek%27s run at the beginning of Volume 3%2C straight through to the present day... all of that crap has one thing in common.  It was all driven by storylines originating %5Bi%5Doutside%5B%2Fi%5D Iron Man%27s own series%2C usually in %5Bi%5DAvengers%5B%2Fi%5D.  As such%2C I no longer trust Marvel not to involve any version of Iron Man in a team without fucking his accompanying solo adventures %5Bi%5Dright in the ear%5B%2Fi%5D%2C which brings us to%0D%0A%0D%0AB%29 %22Initiative%22%2C a word which%2C in this context%2C %5Bi%5Dreeks%5B%2Fi%5D of the dumbfuckery of %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D and its moronic aftermath.  Somehow%2C the blind idiot gods that sit at the center of Marvel Comics and brood while their army of amorphous flautists caper and gibber in a circle around them managed not to ruin %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D with the tainted touch of their filth-encrusted protuberances... but just the tangential mention of something with a name like %5Bi%5DAvengers%3A The Initiative%5B%2Fi%5D makes me wonder if that can last.%0D%0A%0D%0AMaybe it%27s just a coincidence%2C maybe they%27re not thinking of going there at all with the screen version - maybe%2C and we can but hope%2C %5Bi%5DThe Incredible Hulk%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DIron Man II%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DThor%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DCaptain America%3A The First Avenger%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DThe Avengers%5B%2Fi%5D will all be just as awesome as %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D.  Maybe their creators will manage to step deftly around everything that sucks about Marvel Comics today%2C as Jon Favreau and his crew did%2C and build the live-action Marvel equivalent of the DC Animated Universe%3A a moving-picture franchise that hugely surpasses the rotting corpse the original continuity has become%2C in terms of faithfulness to the original spirit and general wonderment.%0D%0A%0D%0ABut to me%2C just the thought of what might come to pass instead%2C brought to mind by the background noise Ultimate Nick Fury and the phrase %22the Avengers Initiative%22 drag along%2C is enough to make this little stinger cast a faint shadow over the whole rest of what was%2C in itself%2C at least a Monstrous %2875%29 motion picture%2C and that%27s an awful shame.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
22|4|21|||||RE%3A Iron Man|mdg1||17:53:13|05/07/2008|You probably don%27t want to know this%2C but Bendis %26 Millar are now claiming that they helped %22fix%22 the script%2C including the stinger.  This bodes ill.
23|5|22|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||18:17:06|05/07/2008|[updated:LAST EDITED ON May-07-08 AT 06:19 PM (EDT)]%3EYou probably don%27t want to know this%2C but Bendis %26 Millar are now %0D%0A%3Eclaiming that they helped %22fix%22 the script%2C including the stinger.  %0D%0A%3EThis bodes ill. %0D%0A%0D%0AYeah%2C uh%2C claims of direct involvement by two of the chief amorphous flautists doesn%27t thrill me - though one wonders what basis there is for believing them%2C given that writers usually engage in ritual combat to get their names into the screen credits even if all they did was pee in the corner of an office that one of the actual writers subsequently used.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
28|6|23|||||RE%3A Iron Man|O_M||07:16:07|05/08/2008|%3E%3EYou probably don%27t want to know this%2C but Bendis %26 Millar are now %0D%0A%3E%3Eclaiming that they helped %22fix%22 the script%2C including the stinger.  %0D%0A%3E%3EThis bodes ill. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EYeah%2C uh%2C claims of direct involvement by two of the chief amorphous %0D%0A%3Eflautists doesn%27t thrill me - though one wonders what basis there is %0D%0A%3Efor believing them%2C given that writers usually engage in ritual combat %0D%0A%3Eto get their names into the screen credits even if all they did was %0D%0A%3Epee in the corner of an office that one of the actual writers %0D%0A%3Esubsequently used. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3E--G. %0D%0A%3E-%3E%3C- %0D%0A%3EBenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin %0D%0A%3EEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F %0D%0A%0D%0AI now have this image of Millar and Bendis in a kal-if-fee duel to the death and Favreau sitting off to the side telling some guy that the hypospray from earlier was actually a placebo.
24|4|21|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Norgarth||19:48:44|05/07/2008|%3E1%29 Since when was Nick Fury black%3F  This isn%27t a racial thing%2C it%27s a %0D%0A%3Econtinuity thing.  Col. Fury - formerly Sgt. Fury of Howling Commandos %0D%0A%3Efame - is a World War II veteran.  It %28and his connection to an %0D%0A%3Eoffshoot of Operation Rebirth%29 gives him his shared history with %0D%0A%3ECaptain America.  Vaguely important%2C I would%27ve thought.  And you %0D%0A%3Edidn%27t find many black commando team leaders in World War II.  They %0D%0A%3Eseem to have just abandoned this bit of the character%27s origin %0D%0A%3Eentirely and gone with the Ultimate Marvel version%2C which brings us to %0D%0A%0D%0AWell%2C they would have had to have altered the backstory even if they went with grizzled caucasian Fury.  Afterall%2C even someone who was 17 in 1940 would be 85 today.  Fury would presumably be into his 90s.%0D%0A%0D%0A%3EMaybe it%27s just a coincidence%2C maybe they%27re not thinking of going %0D%0A%3Ethere at all with the screen version - maybe%2C and we can but hope%2C %0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5DThe Incredible Hulk%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DIron Man II%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DThor%5B%2Fi%5D and %0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5DCaptain America%3A The First Avenger%5B%2Fi%5D and %5Bi%5DThe Avengers%5B%2Fi%5D will %0D%0A%3Eall be just as awesome as %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D.  Maybe their creators will %0D%0A%3Emanage to step deftly around everything that sucks about Marvel Comics %0D%0A%3Etoday%2C as Jon Favreau and his crew did%2C and build the live-action %0D%0A%3EMarvel equivalent of the DC Animated Universe%3A a moving-picture %0D%0A%3Efranchise that hugely surpasses the rotting corpse the original %0D%0A%3Econtinuity has become%2C in terms of faithfulness to the original spirit %0D%0A%3Eand general wonderment. %0D%0A%0D%0ADowney is supposed to have a cameo in Incredible Hulk as Tony Stark. So we may be able to get a slight better idea where they are headed with The Avengers.
25|5|24|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||19:52:54|05/07/2008|%3EWell%2C they would have had to have altered the backstory even if they %0D%0A%3Ewent with grizzled caucasian Fury.  Afterall%2C even someone who was 17 %0D%0A%3Ein 1940 would be 85 today.  Fury would presumably be into his 90s. %0D%0A%0D%0AWell%2C that%27s where the aforementioned connection to Operation Rebirth comes in.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A
30|5|24|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Mephron||11:49:31|05/08/2008|%3EWell%2C they would have had to have altered the backstory even if they %0D%0A%3Ewent with grizzled caucasian Fury.  Afterall%2C even someone who was 17 %0D%0A%3Ein 1940 would be 85 today.  Fury would presumably be into his 90s. %0D%0A%0D%0AJust to enhance what Gryph said%3A Nick Fury %28mainline%29 has the formula for a life-extention drug%2C which explains why he could be in WW2 and still look like a grizzled man in his 40.  %28No explaining Timothy %22Dum-Dum%22 Dugan%2C though...%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--%0D%0AGeoff Depew - Darth Mephron%0D%0AHaberdasher to Androids%2C Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.%0D%0A%22And Remember%21  Google is your Friend%21%21%22
26|4|21|||||RE%3A Iron Man|BLUE||21:45:04|05/07/2008|%3E%3EAnd if it wasn%27t good enough%2C it had Samuel L. Jackson in a cameo%21%0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EYeah%2C uh... I%27m probably revealing myself to be terminally uncool here %0D%0A%3E%28as if that hadn%27t been obvious for years anyway%29%2C but I wasn%27t too %0D%0A%3Esanguine about that whole stinger.  There are several reasons for %0D%0A%3Ethat.  None specifically have to do with Mr. Jackson himself%2C and all %0D%0A%3Eare based more on conjecture than solid information %28because we don%27t %0D%0A%3Ehave any of the latter yet%29%2C but still... I have reservations. %0D%0A%0D%0AI%27ve kind of taken the H2G2 approach to the Marvel movies%3B the H2G2 books%2C radio play%2C Television show%2C and movie were all different versions of the same story%2C and so are the movies Marvel is putting out.  Hopefully the blatant mental toilet flushing that has become the Marvel comic verse won%27t infect the movies too much.%0D%0A%0D%0AI agree%2C Nick Fury was white and in WWII.  Maybe this black Nick Fury was in Vietnam%3F  This is one of the classic issues with comics in general%2C the characters can%27t age at the same rate as the audience.  A lot of the gimmicks that all publishers%2C not just Marvel%2C have come up with are lame.  Let%27s just have the movies be the movies%2C set in today%27s world%2C just inspired by the source material.  I can accept some changes%2C even rather drastic ones.%0D%0A%0D%0AHonestly%2C I haven%27t picked up a Marvel comic in YEARS.  The last one I did read was %27Origin%27%2C because my %28at the time%29 wife had been given a copy at a convention by one of the writers %28she worked in the industry and people like her%29.  The umpty-millionth recreation of the Wolverine origin story was the last nail in the coffin.  That I thought that %27Origin%27 sucked massive wang had nothing to do with the fact I also think that that Logan has been retconned so many times that it%27s surprising he doesn%27t just implode.%0D%0A%0D%0AAnd on a side note%2C I can%27t honestly think of an actor I%27d want to play Fury that isn%27t too old or too young.
27|5|26|||||RE%3A Iron Man|mdg1||22:24:08|05/07/2008|I was thinking%2C the other day%2C that the best way to handle this would be to make %22Nick Fury%22 a codename for a special operative.  That way%2C you could have a Kirby Fury in WW2%2C a Steranko Fury in the 60%27s%2C a Chakyin%2FGoodwin Fury in the Cold War%2C and the SLJ version nowadays.%0D%0A%0D%0A%28The eyepatch is probably somesort of tribute%2Fgadget%28
29|6|27|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Star Ranger4||11:18:23|05/08/2008|%3EI was thinking%2C the other day%2C that the best way to handle this would %0D%0A%3Ebe to make %22Nick Fury%22 a codename for a special operative.  That way%2C %0D%0A%3Eyou could have a Kirby Fury in WW2%2C a Steranko Fury in the 60%27s%2C a %0D%0A%3EChakyin%2FGoodwin Fury in the Cold War%2C and the SLJ version nowadays. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3E%28The eyepatch is probably somesort of tribute%2Fgadget%28 %0D%0A%0D%0AI suppose... Hmm.  throw in some ubertech and make it like a monocular ala the apache drivers use or the infamous %27data glasses%27 from just about every cyberpunk based game.
31|6|27|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Norgarth||16:44:47|05/08/2008|%3EI was thinking%2C the other day%2C that the best way to handle this would %0D%0A%3Ebe to make %22Nick Fury%22 a codename for a special operative.  That way%2C %0D%0A%3Eyou could have a Kirby Fury in WW2%2C a Steranko Fury in the 60%27s%2C a %0D%0A%3EChakyin%2FGoodwin Fury in the Cold War%2C and the SLJ version nowadays. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3E%28The eyepatch is probably somesort of tribute%2Fgadget%28 %0D%0A%0D%0AI%27ve been mentally applying the same sort of logic to James Bond for several years now.  8%29%0D%0A%0D%0Aand from further up the thread%3A%0D%0A%0D%0A%3EWell%2C that%27s where the aforementioned connection to Operation Rebirth comes %3Ein.%0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3E--G.%0D%0A%0D%0A%2Ablinks%2A DOH%21 8p
32|7|31|||||RE%3A Iron Man|mdg1||18:08:51|05/08/2008|Where%27d you think I got the idea%3F %3B%29
38|5|26|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|MOGSY||18:02:47|05/12/2008|I%27ve been wondering about the whole issue of continuity in general%2C and when and if a character%2C team%2C story ought to be retired...%0D%0A%0D%0AI look at it this way%2C it seems to me like it%27s extraordinarily difficult to keep a creative property going past let%27s say for argument%27s sake 10 years for the good%2Fexcellent%2C 20-30 years the exceptional%2C and 60 years for the iconic.  I think sooner or later almost everything is going to run out of steam in terms of popularity and juice outside of nostalgia%2C the occasional revival%2C or outside of a niche fanbase.  Terry and the Pirates %28the character aged%2C had a career%2C and retired in-story if I%27m not mistaken%29%2C pulps%2C Conan%2C ERB properties%2C etc I think are all decent examples of this.%0D%0A%0D%0AI think a lot of the big Marvel properties have been finally hitting that stage that DC hit in the %2780s which kinda warranted the original %22Crisis.%22 %28Personally%2C I%27d argue that Marvel hit that stage in the mid-90%27s%2C but the entire %22Ultimate%22 brand staved off the inevitable for a bit%29.  I mean%2C c%27mon%2C Marvel Zombies%3F %28it%27s actually a good story and I love the art%2C but I think it demonstrates the end of the road%2C personally%29%0D%0A%0D%0AThe sadist %22deconstruction%22 %28yeah%2C yeah I know it%27s an artsy-fartsy phrase%2C but man%2C it fits%29 of Spider-man that%27s been going on non-stop since the whole Clone mess %28that%27s what broke me off Marvel%2C except for the odd graphic novel%2C years ago%29%2C the recent garbage with Mary Jane%2C the Ultimates themselves %28yes%2C it was timely%2C also%2C I loved the WWII depiction of Cap%2C but....%29 - I don%27t get it.  It%27s like the people writing Marvel secretly hate what they%27re working on%2C and also...I really don%27t understand just _who_ they%27re writing _for_.%0D%0A%0D%0AIs their target audience really the adult version of the kid who%27s been buying these books religiously for the past 25 years%2C non-stop%2C only now giving them all the %22adult%22 content they want because the %22Spider-friends%22 Saturday-morning style just doesn%27t work for them anymore%3F  If so%2C I actually think it%27s kinda creepy.  As much as I enjoy grown-up comics stories%2C there%27s just something %22wrong%22 that I can%27t put my finger on whenever I read about modern Marvel.  The Justice League series and its spin-offs were really the last %22classic%22 %28Marvel and DC in my own little taxonomy%29 comics-related anything I%27ve paid much attention to outside of Eyrie%2C outside of the recent Marvel movies.  I%27ll take an episode of something like %22Batman Beyond%22 over what Marvel%27s putting out now any day of the week.%0D%0A%0D%0AI think maybe it%27s just about time that Marvel consider putting some of its series out to pasture%2C or at least%2C into %22syndication.%22 Spidey%2C at least in the form of the series going all the way back to Stan and co%2C is done.  They should let it go.  Go with the occasional special%2C or graphic novel%2C or something like that.    Marvel%27s a mess%2C and I really don%27t know about DC because I always dug the cartoons over the comics anyway.  %0D%0A%0D%0AOf course none of what I just wrote has any real bearing on the _business_ side of the house%2C which undoubtedly has more to do with %22the Never-ending Story%22 aspect of comics.  End rant.%0D%0A%0D%0AI always wanted to write the %22Ultimate Archies%22 Story%2C where Jughead is the only one to realize that he%27s been in a temporal loop for the past 50 years%2C goes nuts trying to explain to everyone that they%27ve repeated high school ad nauseam for decades%2C and kills everyone%2C just to get rid of the dang series. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A%22A good plan executed now is better than a perfect plan next week%22 - Gen George S. Patton%2C Jr.
34|4|21|||||RE%3A Iron Man|Croaker||10:48:21|05/12/2008|Random thought%3A%0D%0A%0D%0AIf -anyone- was going to play a black Nick Fury%2C would there be a better actor for it than Samuel L Jackson%3F%0D%0A%0D%0A%28Now%2C me%2C I didn%27t mind the Hoff as him much at all%2C but then%2C my taste is renowned here for being... eclectic.%29
35|5|34|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||12:00:53|05/12/2008|%3EIf -anyone- was going to play a black Nick Fury%2C would there be a %0D%0A%3Ebetter actor for it than Samuel L Jackson%3F %0D%0A%0D%0AWell%2C given that they drew the version of Nick in %5Bi%5DThe Ultimates%5B%2Fi%5D to look like Jackson on purpose... no%2C not really. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0ACeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
39|6|35|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|BobSchroeck||18:35:18|05/12/2008|%3EWell%2C given that they drew the version of Nick in %5Bi%5DThe Ultimates%5B%2Fi%5D %0D%0A%3Eto look like Jackson on purpose... no%2C not really. %3A%29 %0D%0A%0D%0ANot just on purpose%2C but with his knowledge and permission...  and%2C I suspect%2C a hint that they just might hire him for the job when the time came.%0D%0A%0D%0A-- Bob%0D%0A-------------------%0D%0AI intend to be a freak for the rest of my life%2C and I shall baffle you with cabbages and rhinoceroses in the kitchen and incessant quotations from %5Bi%5DNow We Are Six%5B%2Fi%5D through the mouthpiece of Lord Snooty%27s giant poisoned electric head.  So theeeeeere...
33|1|0|||||RE%3A Iron Man|StClair||13:48:22|05/09/2008|When the icing problem comes up for the second time%2C I immediately thought of the scene in %22Lost and Found%22 where Nimrod asks his successor if he%27s ever been in temporal stasis.%0D%0A
36|1|0|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|cyberpagan||16:30:51|05/12/2008|[updated:LAST EDITED ON May-12-08 AT 04:31 PM (EDT)]My only major problem with it was him not maintaining a secret idenity. I mean not even the other avengers knew Stark was Iron Man. Just that Tony paid the bills and their paychecks%2C and figured Iron Man was just a Stark employee.%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%0D%0ARemember%2C two wrongs do not make a right%2C but three lefts do.%0D%0A%0D%0AI%27m really here%2C but I%27m not here%2C really.%0D%0A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%2A%0D%0ARCW%23665 the other neighbor of the beast
37|2|36|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||17:34:12|05/12/2008|%3EMy only major problem with it was him not maintaining a secret %0D%0A%3Eidenity. I mean not even the other avengers knew Stark was Iron Man. %0D%0A%3EJust that Tony paid the bills and their paychecks%2C and figured Iron %0D%0A%3EMan was just a Stark employee. %0D%0A%0D%0AIronically%2C that led to big problems on at least one occasion%2C when Tony started dating Jan Van Dyne while Hank Pym was in prison.  She was a bit ticked off to find out that her new beau was%2C in fact%2C an Avengers colleague who was at least nominally supposed to be Hank%27s friend.%0D%0A%0D%0AAs for me%2C I rather liked the %22I am Iron Man%22 twist%2C for all that it%27s led to %5Bi%5Dunmitigated disaster%5B%2Fi%5D both times they%27ve attempted it in the comics.  After all that Tony%27s been through in the movie leading up to that part%2C it makes %5Bi%5Dsense%5B%2Fi%5D that he would suddenly balk at the idea of spouting yet another government-sponsored lie%2C throw away the cards%2C and wing it in full-disclosure mode instead.%0D%0A%0D%0AHowever%2C I find myself suspecting that%2C when we get to %5Bi%5DIron Man II%5B%2Fi%5D%2C we%27ll be told that SHIELD somehow managed to sanitize that situation with or without Tony%27s connivance.  Nick Fury%27s disgusted reaction in the stinger implies it - his whole demeanor cries out %22you%2C sir%2C have just made my life unnecessarily difficult%22 - as do a few things in %5Bi%5DIron Man%3A Viva Las Vegas%5B%2Fi%5D.%0D%0A%0D%0AMind you%2C VLV might not be set in the movie continuity%2C but given that it%27s written by Jon Favreau and features the movie designs for the armor and the main characters %28Pepper%2C in particular%2C looks as much like Gwyneth Paltrow as Adi Granov can draw her%29%2C it seems likely - and in it%2C a couple of civilians talking to Tony Stark allow as they%27d %5Bi%5Dreally%5B%2Fi%5D like to meet his totally cool bodyguard%2C as if they believe the two are not the same person.%0D%0A%0D%0A%28On the flip side%2C Tony also doesn%27t have a glowing disk mounted in the middle of his chest in VLV%2C but it%27s not like it%27d be beyond his technical abilities to shrink it further and come up with a convincing fake chest to hide it under. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0ACeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
40|3|37|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|trigger||21:23:41|05/12/2008|%3EAs for me%2C I rather liked the %22I am Iron Man%22 twist%2C for all that it%27s %0D%0A%3Eled to %5Bi%5Dunmitigated disaster%5B%2Fi%5D both times they%27ve attempted it in %0D%0A%3Ethe comics.  After all that Tony%27s been through in the movie leading %0D%0A%3Eup to that part%2C it makes %5Bi%5Dsense%5B%2Fi%5D that he would suddenly balk at %0D%0A%3Ethe idea of spouting yet another government-sponsored lie%2C throw away %0D%0A%3Ethe cards%2C and wing it in full-disclosure mode instead. %0D%0A%0D%0AI%27ll bow to your knowledge of all things Iron Man%2C but I actually thought the full disclosure was awesome from a character building perspective. %0D%0A%0D%0AIt%27s a major point of angst for every superhero%28TM%29 to hide his identity from those that love him. To blow that away sets %5Bi%5DIron Man%5B%2Fi%5D on a completely different plane then other characters.  That%27s why I hope they hold on to the idea of him being public %28and all the problems that causes%29 to keep distinguishing him from every other suited dude on the screen %28see http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DNlLeCu63HCA%29.%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%3EHowever%2C I find myself suspecting that%2C when we get to %5Bi%5DIron Man %0D%0A%3EII%5B%2Fi%5D%2C we%27ll be told that SHIELD somehow managed to sanitize that %0D%0A%3Esituation with or without Tony%27s connivance.  Nick Fury%27s disgusted %0D%0A%3Ereaction in the stinger implies it - his whole demeanor cries out %0D%0A%3E%22you%2C sir%2C have just made my life unnecessarily difficult%22 - as do a %0D%0A%3Efew things in %5Bi%5DIron Man%3A Viva Las Vegas%5B%2Fi%5D. %0D%0A%0D%0AThat would be such a sellout...so yeah%2C you%27re probably right. Stalinization all the way.%0D%0A%0D%0AThank Eris%2A for fan fiction.  Eyre Productions%2C a day doesn%27t go by when I don%27t owe you one.%2A%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0At.%0D%0A%0D%0Ap.s.%0D%0A%3ECeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam. %0D%0A%0D%0AAny particular reason you%27ve got in for Tunisia%3F%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%2Ayeah%2C I know that other guy invented it first%2C but UF and rec.arts.anime were the innovators%2C VC angels%2C publicists%2C and media engine that made it more than an obscure way to up the noise-to-content ratio.%0D%0A %0D%0A%0D%0ATrigger Argee%0D%0Atrigger_argee%40hotmail.com%0D%0AManon%2C Maccadon%2C Orado%2C etc.%0D%0ADenton%2C never leave home without it.%0D%0A%0D%0A%22I hate to advocate drugs%2C alcohol%2C violence%2C or insanity to anyone%2C but they%27ve always worked for me.%22 - HST
41|4|40|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||21:38:46|05/12/2008|%3E%3EAs for me%2C I rather liked the %22I am Iron Man%22 twist%2C for all that it%27s %0D%0A%3E%3Eled to %5Bi%5Dunmitigated disaster%5B%2Fi%5D both times they%27ve attempted it in %0D%0A%3E%3Ethe comics.%0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EI%27ll bow to your knowledge of all things Iron Man%2C but I actually %0D%0A%3Ethought the full disclosure was awesome from a character building %0D%0A%3Eperspective.%0D%0A%0D%0AWell%2C the first time%2C it had potential%2C and arguably led to some interesting storytelling %28though frankly I could have done without the whole %22Iron Man%3A Secretary of Defense%22 thing%29%2C but for %5Bi%5DTony himself%5B%2Fi%5D it was an utter disaster%2C and eventually led to exactly what every superhero who maintains a secret identity knows will happen if he doesn%27t%3A loved ones getting killed by enemies of his hero identity.%0D%0A%0D%0AThe second time%2C it%27s part and parcel of Tony%27s revolting mischaracterization as regards %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D%2C and as such is a %5Bi%5Dtextbook%5B%2Fi%5D example of the fruit of the poison tree.  But don%27t go by me.  I regard the entirety of %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D as the exemplar of everything that%27s wrong with Marvel Comics in the 21st century%2C and I know a lot of people don%27t see it that way.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0ACeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
42|5|41|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Bad Moon||23:41:20|05/12/2008|%3EThe second time%2C it%27s part and parcel of Tony%27s revolting %0D%0A%3Emischaracterization as regards %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D%2C and as such is a %0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5Dtextbook%5B%2Fi%5D example of the fruit of the poison tree.  But don%27t go %0D%0A%3Eby me.  I regard the entirety of %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D as the exemplar of %0D%0A%3Eeverything that%27s wrong with Marvel Comics in the 21st century%2C and I %0D%0A%3Eknow a lot of people don%27t see it that way. %0D%0A%0D%0AThat%27s odd%2C because I have yet to meet somebody %28physically speaking%29 that has found %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D to be anything but a big joke%2C and have a sort of %22wake me when September comes%22 attitude toward it.  But%2C maybe that%27s just the local comics scene here.%0D%0A%0D%0A------%0D%0AJon Helscher%0D%0A%0D%0AI%27m here to slow you down%2C cost you money%2C and generally retard the process.%0D%0A%0D%0A-Mike Rowe%3A  Dirty Jobs
43|6|42|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||23:58:32|05/12/2008|%3EThat%27s odd%2C because I have yet to meet somebody %28physically speaking%29 %0D%0A%3Ethat has found %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D to be anything but a big joke%2C and %0D%0A%3Ehave a sort of %22wake me when September comes%22 attitude toward it.  %0D%0A%3EBut%2C maybe that%27s just the local comics scene here. %0D%0A%0D%0A%5Bi%5DSomebody%5B%2Fi%5D must be enjoying it%2C unless Marvel%27s just making up those sales figures.  Which is conceivable%2C I suppose%2C but not likely.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0ACeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
44|7|43|||||RE%3A Iron Man|mdg1||06:32:00|05/13/2008|I figure it%27s readers who%27ve never read the really good stuff.  Same reason why they think the JMS run on Thor is so great....
45|5|41|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|trigger||20:09:00|05/13/2008|%3Ebut for %5Bi%5DTony %0D%0A%3Ehimself%5B%2Fi%5D it was an utter disaster%2C and eventually led to exactly %0D%0A%3Ewhat every superhero who maintains a secret identity knows will happen %0D%0A%3Eif he doesn%27t%3A loved ones getting killed by enemies of his hero %0D%0A%3Eidentity. %0D%0A%0D%0ASee%2C that doesn%27t make sense for me.  He%27s already the head of large munitions firm %28yeah%2C yeah%2C he%27s stopping that%29 with a cadre of body guards.  His only %22family%22 if Col. Rhodes %28already in a dangerous job where people shoot at you%29%2C Pepper Pots %28who as his %22famous%22 assistant should have her own body guards anyway%29%2C and...what the various girls he sleeps with%3F These don%27t strike me as terribly vulnerable targets - at least no more vulnerable than say Britney Spear%27s kids. %0D%0A%0D%0AIf the issue is%2C well%2C the capacity of his enemies%2C then in the movie-verse he hasn%27t take on a baddie who %28a%29 could attack his loved ones directly or %28b%29 didn%27t already know who he was. Obviously%2C he wouldn%27t be a hero if that didn%27t change%2C but on the same hand%2C if the bad dudes are attacking someone %28say a random stranger%29 isn%27t a hero obligated to treat them the same as a loved one%3F%0D%0A%0D%0AThe people near him were already at risk%3B making it clear you had an armored battlesuit capable of taking out any fool who attacks them might be a deterrent.  At the least it simplifies the personal life immensely. I%27d say in his case%2C he made the right move.  %0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%3E But don%27t go %0D%0A%3Eby me.  I regard the entirety of %5Bi%5DCivil War%5B%2Fi%5D as the exemplar of %0D%0A%3Eeverything that%27s wrong with Marvel Comics in the 21st century%2C and I %0D%0A%3Eknow a lot of people don%27t see it that way. %0D%0A%0D%0AWhat little I%27ve seen...I hate.  The best response online to it so far %28IMHO%29 is  Adrian Tullberg%27s %5Ba href%3D%22http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fanfiction.net%2Fs%2F3956772%2F1%2FDivine_Intervention%22%5DDivine Intervention%5B%2Fa%5D%2C although it treats that CW Tony pretty badly....%0D%0A%0D%0At.%0D%0A%0D%0ATrigger Argee%0D%0Atrigger_argee%40hotmail.com%0D%0AManon%2C Maccadon%2C Orado%2C etc.%0D%0ADenton%2C never leave home without it.%0D%0A%0D%0A%22I hate to advocate drugs%2C alcohol%2C violence%2C or insanity to anyone%2C but they%27ve always worked for me.%22 - HST
46|6|45|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Gryphon||20:21:22|05/13/2008|%3E%3Ebut for %5Bi%5DTony %0D%0A%3E%3Ehimself%5B%2Fi%5D it was an utter disaster%2C and eventually led to exactly %0D%0A%3E%3Ewhat every superhero who maintains a secret identity knows will happen %0D%0A%3E%3Eif he doesn%27t%3A loved ones getting killed by enemies of his hero %0D%0A%3E%3Eidentity. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3ESee%2C that doesn%27t make sense for me.%0D%0A%0D%0AIn the context of the movie%2C perhaps%2C but that%27s not what I%27m talking about%3B I%27m talking about the first time he revealed it in the comics%2C which involved somewhat different circumstances.  I already %5Bi%5Dsaid%5B%2Fi%5D I thought it worked given the place he found himself in at that point in the movie.  %28The fact that it completely sucked in the comics both times was offered by way of contrast%2C you see...%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited  http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0ACeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
47|7|46|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|trigger||00:10:41|05/14/2008|Ah%2C I missed that earlier.  %0D%0A%0D%0Athanks%2C%0D%0At.%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0A%0D%0ATrigger Argee%0D%0Atrigger_argee%40hotmail.com%0D%0AManon%2C Maccadon%2C Orado%2C etc.%0D%0ADenton%2C never leave home without it.%0D%0A%0D%0A%22I hate to advocate drugs%2C alcohol%2C violence%2C or insanity to anyone%2C but they%27ve always worked for me.%22 - HST
48|5|41|||1||RE%3A Iron Man|Bad Moon||04:03:39|05/14/2008|%3EWell%2C the first time%2C it had potential%2C and arguably led to some %0D%0A%3Einteresting storytelling %28though frankly I could have done without the %0D%0A%3Ewhole %22Iron Man%3A Secretary of Defense%22 thing%29%2C but for %5Bi%5DTony %0D%0A%3Ehimself%5B%2Fi%5D it was an utter disaster%2C and eventually led to %5Bb%5Dexactly %0D%0A%3Ewhat every superhero who maintains a secret identity knows will happen %0D%0A%3Eif he doesn%27t%3A loved ones getting killed by enemies of his hero %0D%0A%3Eidentity.%5B%2Fb%5D%0D%0A%0D%0AArt imitates message board thread.%0D%0A%0D%0A %0D%0Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.penny-arcade.com%2Fcomic%2F2008%2F5%2F14%2F%0D%0A%0D%0A------%0D%0AJon Helscher%0D%0A%0D%0AI%27m here to slow you down%2C cost you money%2C and generally retard the process.%0D%0A%0D%0A-Mike Rowe%3A  Dirty Jobs