18||0|2244|0|yes 0|0|0|||||Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Star Ranger4||13:50:05|06/22/2011|You know%2C in re-re-re reading S5M1 here it really occurs to me just how well G has manage to clearly enumerate a difference between Aikos %27side%27 and Utenas.%0D%0A%0D%0AThe Aes and the Vannir learn and adapt. the Daemons dont. Even here we see things seemingly repeating themselves as Akio %28who may THINK he%27s been learning from his mistakes%29 keeps trying the same things over and over and expecting different results. Touga keeps being his smarmy self and winding up as street Pizza for his efforts. I think Nanami is right even though she hid it in sarcasm... Touga does seem to wind up as street pizza often enough that one might%2C in fact%2C believe that its become part of his makeup and he does%2C at some level%2C enjoy it. In a lot of ways he does seem quite the Masochist now that he%27s dead... %0D%0A%0D%0AHave I ever mentioned what the definition of Insanity is%3F%0D%0A%0D%0A 1|1|0|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Droken||17:30:20|06/22/2011|If I recall my Robin Williams properly%2C it%27s performing the same action twice and expecting a different result. Yea%2C Touga seems an apt example of that. 2|2|1|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Pasha||18:26:01|06/22/2011|%3EIf I recall my Robin Williams properly%2C it%27s performing the same %0D%0A%3Eaction twice and expecting a different result. Yea%2C Touga seems an apt %0D%0A%3Eexample of that. %0D%0A%0D%0AIt%27s probably older then this%2C but that%27s the Alcoholics Anonymous version. %0D%0A%0D%0AIt%27s what addicts do%3A Have a drink%2C snort a line%2C attack the Tenjou%2FRavenhair%2FHutchins clan%0D%0A%0D%0A-- %0D%0A-Pasha%0D%0AWhat was that feeling again%3F%0D%0AOh yes.%0D%0A-Rage- 3|2|1|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|clg||20:47:18|06/22/2011|As opposed to quantum mechanics%2C which is performing the same action twice and getting a different result %3AP 4|1|0|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|drakensis||04:05:32|06/23/2011|In Scion terms it%27s part of his Legend. He%27s fatebound to be foiled by a plucky girl with a sword. Every. Time. 5|2|4|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|The Traitor||09:35:57|06/23/2011|I%27m gonna go out on a limb here and say that gender reassignment surgery has come along a bit since the present era thanks to gene therapy. What Akio needs to do is drug Utena and run her through a machine that does... well... that. Chromosomal fiddling%2C to make it sound strangely filthy.%0D%0A%0D%0AExcept that this%27d just piss her off%2C and then it%27d go worse for him. But nobody likes it when the bad guy wins except me%2C so y%27know.%0D%0A%0D%0A---%0D%0A%22Yeah%2C I%27m definitely going to hell%2FBut I%27ll have all the best stories to tell%22 -- Frank Turner%2C The Ballad of Me and My Friends 6|3|5|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|StClair||21:13:34|06/23/2011|Then it would be a different girl that does it the next time. 7|3|5|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Gryphon||21:21:52|06/23/2011|%3EChromosomal fiddling%2C to make it %0D%0A%3Esound strangely filthy. %0D%0A%0D%0AYeah%2C uh%2C that%27ll be because there%27s pretty much no way to make %5Bi%5Dnonconsensual gender reassignment%5B%2Fi%5D %5Bi%5Dnot%5B%2Fi%5D sound filthy. I mean%2C not to put too fine a point on it%2C but %5Bi%5DJesus H. Christ%2C%5B%2Fi%5D yo.%0D%0A%0D%0A%3EBut nobody likes it when the bad guy wins except me%2C so y%27know. %0D%0A%0D%0AThat%27s a pretty strange thing to like%2C unless you%27re a bad guy. And around here%2C I mean%2C not only are you sort of totally barking up the wrong tree%2C you had to walk past a huge sign reading YOU HAVE ARRIVED AT THE WRONG TREE to get there. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A%5Bi%5DCeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.%5B%2Fi%5D 11|4|7|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|The Traitor||18:59:49|06/24/2011|%3E%3EChromosomal fiddling%2C to make it %0D%0A%3E%3Esound strangely filthy. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EYeah%2C uh%2C that%27ll be because there%27s pretty much no way to make %0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5Dnonconsensual gender reassignment%5B%2Fi%5D %5Bi%5Dnot%5B%2Fi%5D sound filthy. I %0D%0A%3Emean%2C not to put too fine a point on it%2C but %5Bi%5DJesus H. Christ%2C%5B%2Fi%5D %0D%0A%3Eyo. %0D%0A%0D%0AI could really have phrased that better. I%27m trans myself%2C so there%27s no real squick about GRS %28a bit of squick about the fact that it won%27t be on the NHS any more because David Cameron hates%2C well%2C anyone who didn%27t go to school with him%29%2C but yeah. I meant the phrase %22chromosomal fiddling%22 might be something an elderly man in a trenchcoat might use to proposition a 25th-century young lad... oh gods%2C stop digging%2C Cassie%2C stop digging...%0D%0A%0D%0A%3E%3EBut nobody likes it when the bad guy wins except me%2C so y%27know. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EThat%27s a pretty strange thing to like%2C unless you%27re a bad guy. And %0D%0A%3Earound here%2C I mean%2C not only are you sort of totally barking up the %0D%0A%3Ewrong tree%2C you had to walk past a huge sign reading YOU HAVE ARRIVED %0D%0A%3EAT THE WRONG TREE to get there. %3A%29 %0D%0A%0D%0AI know. I also know why it wouldn%27t work here. I%27m just saying it%27s nice when the protagonist of a story isn%27t the all-conquering hero but actually just gets completely shafted by all the stuff they ignored earlier in the story. You do Classics %28well%2C one module thereof%29%2C you know how much the Greek poets loved that sort of thing. For example%2C say the protagonist%27s a Nineties-style anti-hero in a fantasy setting%2C charging through the evil king%27s Legions of Terror to put him down and rid the land of his tyranny. Now%2C let%27s say that%2C since he%27s an anti-hero he%27s most likely pissed off a whole bunch of people to get to the situation of being in power.%0D%0A%0D%0AThese people%2C the little people - tavern owners%2C bards%2C city watchmen and so forth - don%27t like the fact that he%27s in power %28because this is what happens when a hero takes over a city%29 and a revolution starts up. To cling to power%2C the anti-hero starts detaining people who%27d seek to overthrow him - in the name of freedom%2C you understand - and it%27s not long before he has a violent insurrection to deal with. He has to crack down to govern the way he wishes. Some farmhand hears about it and gathers together the usual fantasy stereotypes%2C and eventually the anti-hero is killed off by the new guy in exactly the same way as the anti-hero killed the evil lord. It%27s Greek trangedy. It makes you think a bit more than the standard swords%27n%27sorcery yarn. At least%2C I think so...%0D%0A%0D%0A---%0D%0A%22Yeah%2C I%27m definitely going to hell%2FBut I%27ll have all the best stories to tell%22 -- Frank Turner%2C The Ballad of Me and My Friends 12|5|11|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Gryphon||20:19:44|06/24/2011|[updated:LAST EDITED ON Jun-24-11 AT 08:19 PM (EDT)]%3E%3E%3EChromosomal fiddling%2C to make it %0D%0A%3E%3E%3Esound strangely filthy. %0D%0A%3E%3E%0D%0A%3E%3EYeah%2C uh%2C that%27ll be because there%27s pretty much no way to make %0D%0A%3E%3E%5Bi%5Dnonconsensual gender reassignment%5B%2Fi%5D %5Bi%5Dnot%5B%2Fi%5D sound filthy. I %0D%0A%3E%3Emean%2C not to put too fine a point on it%2C but %5Bi%5DJesus H. Christ%2C%5B%2Fi%5D %0D%0A%3E%3Eyo. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EI could really have phrased that better.%0D%0A%0D%0AWell%2C maybe%2C but no matter how you phrase it%2C you%27re still talking about - let me highlight the key word for you here - %5Bbig%5D%5Bbig%5D%5Btt%5Dnonconsensual%5B%2Ftt%5D%5B%2Fbig%5D%5B%2Fbig%5D gender reassignment. That sort of puts the entire matter on a different-colored backdrop%2C you know%3F%0D%0A%0D%0ABut hey%2C maybe I%27m just squeamish. I%27m not down with nonconsensual %5Bi%5Danything%5B%2Fi%5D%2C apart from... let%27s call it villain aliveness reassignment. That does sort of tend to be done without consent by definition.%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A%5Bi%5DCeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.%5B%2Fi%5D 14|6|12|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|CGWolfgang||22:32:17|06/24/2011|%3EBut hey%2C maybe I%27m just squeamish. I%27m not down with nonconsensual %0D%0A%3E%5Bi%5Danything%5B%2Fi%5D%2C apart from... let%27s call it villain aliveness %0D%0A%3Ereassignment. That does sort of tend to be done without consent by %0D%0A%3Edefinition. %0D%0A%0D%0AApologies for being slightly off topic here but I just have to point out that villain aliveness reassignment sounds like a great motto for a comedy-esque%2C beat up the bad guys fighting team. Especially if it could be reworded in Latin. 15|7|14|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Gryphon||23:19:29|06/24/2011|%3E%3EBut hey%2C maybe I%27m just squeamish. I%27m not down with nonconsensual %0D%0A%3E%3E%5Bi%5Danything%5B%2Fi%5D%2C apart from... let%27s call it villain aliveness %0D%0A%3E%3Ereassignment. That does sort of tend to be done without consent by %0D%0A%3E%3Edefinition. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EApologies for being slightly off topic here but I just have to point %0D%0A%3Eout that villain aliveness reassignment sounds like a great motto for %0D%0A%3Ea comedy-esque%2C beat up the bad guys fighting team. Especially if it %0D%0A%3Ecould be reworded in Latin. %0D%0A%0D%0ABelieve me%2C I welcome anything that wanders off topic in this thread at this point. %3A%29%0D%0A%0D%0A--G.%0D%0A-%3E%3C-%0D%0ABenjamin D. Hutchins%2C Co-Founder%2C Editor-in-Chief%2C %26 Forum Admin%0D%0AEyrie Productions%2C Unlimited http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eyrie-productions.com%2F%0D%0A%5Bi%5DCeterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.%5B%2Fi%5D 8|3|5|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Meagen||04:43:16|06/24/2011|%3E What Akio needs to do is drug Utena and run her through a %0D%0A%3Emachine that does... well... that. Chromosomal fiddling%2C to make it %0D%0A%3Esound strangely filthy. %0D%0A%0D%0ALeaving aside the massive%2C massive ick factor of that idea%2C any plan where step 1 is %22kidnap Utena Tenjou%22 is not a very good plan. 9|4|8|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|JFerio||14:37:43|06/24/2011|%3ELeaving aside the massive%2C massive ick factor of that idea%2C any plan %0D%0A%3Ewhere step 1 is %22kidnap Utena Tenjou%22 is not a very good plan. %0D%0A%0D%0AFrom what I can tell%2C most plans that would start like that would have trouble getting to step 3. 10|5|9|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Peter Eng||18:43:14|06/24/2011|%3E%3ELeaving aside the massive%2C massive ick factor of that idea%2C any plan %0D%0A%3E%3Ewhere step 1 is %22kidnap Utena Tenjou%22 is not a very good plan. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EFrom what I can tell%2C most plans that would start like that would have %0D%0A%3Etrouble getting to step 3. %0D%0A%0D%0AFound in the paper recycling bin at Ohtori Academy%2C Oriphos%3A%0D%0A%0D%0A1. Kidnap Utena Tenjou.%0D%0A2. %3F%3F%3F%3F%0D%0A3. Pain and suffering %28mine%29%0D%0A%0D%0APeter Eng%0D%0A--%0D%0AInsert humorous comment here. 13|5|9|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|trboturtle2||21:18:11|06/24/2011|%3E%3ELeaving aside the massive%2C massive ick factor of that idea%2C any plan %0D%0A%3E%3Ewhere step 1 is %22kidnap Utena Tenjou%22 is not a very good plan. %0D%0A%3E%0D%0A%3EFrom what I can tell%2C most plans that would start like that would have %0D%0A%3Etrouble getting to step 3. %0D%0A%0D%0AUnless the plan is%3A%0D%0A%0D%0A1%29 Try to kidnap Utena Tenjou%0D%0A2%29 When Step 1 fails%2C Run real fast and pray you%27ll outrun her and all her friends.%0D%0A3%29 When Step 2 fails%2CDie a messy death.%0D%0A%0D%0ASee%3F B-D%0D%0A%0D%0ACraig%0D%0A 16|4|8|||1||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|BobSchroeck||07:22:42|06/25/2011|%3Eany plan where step 1 is %22kidnap Utena Tenjou%22 is not a very good plan. %0D%0A%0D%0ADoubly so if it makes you lose your hat in the process.%0D%0A%0D%0A-- Bob%0D%0A-------------------%0D%0AMy race is pacifist and does not believe in war. We kill only out of personal spite. 17|5|16|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Bushido||10:24:50|06/25/2011|%22Any plan where you lose your hat is a bad plan.%22 18|6|17|||||RE%3A Ash Knight revisited yet again...|Star Ranger4||00:59:02|06/27/2011|%3E%22Any plan where you lose your hat is a bad plan.%22 %0D%0A%0D%0AEspecially when it was still attached to your head when the loss happens.%0D%0A%0D%0A