Not 100% sure, but it seems to be EN Generation 4 is coming, with a preview tonight at 8:00pm PST (11:00pm EST/.

Not much else to say right now, other than it's 4 members instead of the usual 5, and they made an "innit?" joke in the video title, so might be some sort of British-EN instead of American-EN.

Stay tuned.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

I said back a couple months ago, there was a suspicious number of British vtubers announcing graduations/hiatuses all at once~

Looks like Kiara's finally getting some European sisters!

The reveal trailer!

LAST EDITED ON Jun-21-24 AT 08:27 PM (EDT) by Gryphon (admin)
 
[ just moving Gigi's so they're listed in chronological order, because it was bugging me and it's my forum so hey ho :) --G. ]

Their debut stream waiting rooms:
Elizabeth (she HAS to be British, right?)
Gigi
Cecilia
Raora (might be Italian?)

LAST EDITED ON Jun-20-24 AT 01:19 AM (EDT)
 
>Their debut stream waiting rooms:
>Elizabeth (she HAS to be
>British, right?)
>Cecilia
>Raora (might be Italian?)
>Gigi

The current speculation is:

Elizabeth - British (what sort remains to be seen)
Cecilia - German
Raora - Italian
Gigi - French

If those prove to be true, then this isn't HoloEN Gen 4, it's HoloEU Gen 1*

*(Kiwawa counts as HoloEU Gen 0).

To follow up...

Raora is Italian but lives in Japan
Cecilia (probably) is German but lives in Norway

Elizabeth (probably) is British (English)
Gigi (probably) is Filipino and is in America (West Coast)

>To follow up...
>
>Raora is Italian but lives in Japan
>Cecilia (probably) is German but lives in Norway
>
>Elizabeth (probably) is British (English)
>Gigi (probably) is Filipino and is in America (West Coast)

Boy howdy, that's a time zone spread and a half. All-hands collabs for that crew are going to kill somebody.

--G.
probably not literally. maybe literally.
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While I'm at it, I don't want to seem overly petulant and entitled, but it would be dope if the organization had more than... hang on... you can't take three from two, two is less than three, so you look at the four in the eights place... one member operating on Eastern time.

--G.
the statistically anomalous number in the Central time zone is close, but I mean jeez
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>>To follow up...
>>
>>Raora is Italian but lives in Japan
>>Cecilia (probably) is German but lives in Norway
>>
>>Elizabeth (probably) is British (English)
>>Gigi (probably) is Filipino and is in America (West Coast)
>
>Boy howdy, that's a time zone spread and a half. All-hands collabs
>for that crew are going to kill somebody.
>
>--G.
>probably not literally. maybe literally.
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They even commissioned art kind of making fun of this.

...feels kind of weird that Hololive made a statement, as I recall, that rather than Nijisanji's desperate scraping and scrabbling for new talent they were going to choose to cultivate their existing talent and not introduce bunches of new people...

...and yet here they are almost immediately after saying that introducing a bunch of new people. How disingenuous.

>...feels kind of weird that Hololive made a statement, as I recall,
>that rather than Nijisanji's desperate scraping and scrabbling for new
>talent they were going to choose to cultivate their existing talent
>and not introduce bunches of new people...
>
>...and yet here they are almost immediately after saying that
>introducing a bunch of new people. How disingenuous.

You know that there's a lead time on debuts, right? Their twitters were created back in April. They were already accepted before the announcement was made, just not debuted.

LAST EDITED ON Jun-19-24 AT 00:32 AM (EDT)
 
>You know that there's a lead time on debuts, right? Their twitters
>were created back in April. They were already accepted before the
>announcement was made, just not debuted.

On the other hand, that means that for some time now, there's been a standing plan to give Advent not even a full year to themselves. I get that the two units' lore is interlocked (though let's be honest, that's going to last all of 20 minutes :), but it still seems a bit... crowdy. Admittedly, that may be a reflection of just how fast Advent got traction.

I'unno, at this moment, I'm not really feelin' it. The timing feels wrong and none of the designs particularly grabs me. Hopefully that's just my general fatigue level talking, and I'll look back on this post in a few months and think One toke, you poor fool? Wait 'til you see those goddamn bats, man. After all, I should know by now that vtubers always take a little while to become who they're gonna be, and their debuts often have little to do with the end result.

--G.
also, 19 is a number that offends my sensibilities, but I freely acknowledge that this is my problem and not HoloEN's. :)
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>>You know that there's a lead time on debuts, right? Their twitters
>>were created back in April. They were already accepted before the
>>announcement was made, just not debuted.
>
>On the other hand, that means that for some time now, there's been a
>standing plan to give Advent not even a full year to themselves. I
>get that the two units' lore is interlocked (though let's be honest,
>that's going to last all of 20 minutes :), but it still seems a bit...
>crowdy. Admittedly, that may be a reflection of just how fast Advent
>got traction.
>
>I'unno, at this moment, I'm not really feelin' it. The timing feels
>wrong and none of the designs particularly grabs me. Hopefully that's
>just my general fatigue level talking, and I'll look back on this post
>in a few months and think One toke, you poor fool? Wait 'til you
>see those goddamn bats, man. After all, I should know by now that
>vtubers always take a little while to become who they're gonna be, and
>their debuts often have little to do with the end result.
>
>--G.

FWIW, the long gap between Council and Advent is atypical. There was also only 11 months between Myth and Council.

(Actually, I think holostars EN Tempus took the debut timing slot between Council and Advent. They were also about 11 months after Council.)

>FWIW, the long gap between Council and Advent is atypical. There was
>also only 11 months between Myth and Council.

That's fair. I guess my overarching disquiet is with the relentless growth curve of the organization in general. It feels like they're planning for turnover and not actually having turnover, so the roster just gets more and more crowded as they keep piling in new blood. Not that I want turnover! I'm just saying it feels to me like the organization is designed for a certain churn rate that it doesn't have, and it's getting a bit out of balance. This has been so on the .jp side for some time, and now I feel like we're seeing it start to develop over here too.

Or maybe I'm just a grumpy old fecker who has to work his way into anything that's different. Time will tell! :)

Of course when they talk among themselves about the Elder Days, the members of Myth often sound as though they were alone on the Wall, holding back the barbarians by themselves, for eleven generations; but I'm sure it felt that way to them in the annus horribilis that was 2020.

--G.
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I think it's related to both the English/US based office they're opening, plus the longstanding desire to open up in Europe. Kiara especially has been campaigning for it *hard*, being all alone on the entire *continent*.

I also think they may have pushed up Justice slightly because Advent came out like a cannonball. They've all SOLIDLY made themselves part of the company, to the point I was sure they've been there closer to eighteen months. They've slotted in faster and more completely than any of the other groups in *any* branch, and *with* every branch. (....Except maybe Holostars, but the boys get no love from anyone except Kobo.)

>...feels kind of weird that Hololive made a statement, as I recall,
>that rather than Nijisanji's desperate scraping and scrabbling for new
>talent they were going to choose to cultivate their existing talent
>and not introduce bunches of new people...
>
>...and yet here they are almost immediately after saying that
>introducing a bunch of new people. How disingenuous.

Hololive gens/groups usually take months to put together (auditions, hiring, design work, etc), so I feel pretty confident in guessing that Holo Justice was already being worked on before Anycolor decided to blow their own foot off with the Selen termination and everything that followed. So whatever blowback they might receive for announcing a new group after saying they were holding off on hiring for awhile would not outweigh the uproar if it got out that they'd put the kibosh on an ongoing effort just to piss in Riku's coffee.

>Hololive gens/groups usually take months to put together (auditions,
>hiring, design work, etc), so I feel pretty confident in guessing that
>Holo Justice was already being worked on before Anycolor
>decided to blow their own foot off with the Selen termination and
>everything that followed. So whatever blowback they might receive for
>announcing a new group after saying they were holding off on hiring
>for awhile would not outweigh the uproar if it got out that they'd put
>the kibosh on an ongoing effort just to piss in Riku's coffee.

Looking at the timeframe off the batch of european vtubers who graduated/announced hiatuses a few months ago, they likely had the audition wave being done around February at the latest. So while there was probably plans before then, the actual doings were probably after Dokibird reemerged and Niji started imploding under its own sheer mass of horseshit.

That said, I also don't think Holo is rushing anything. Niji has long been accused of just shotgunning waves out three, four times a year. Justice is eleven months from Advent and I think they pushed it up largely because of how completely Advent has integrated.

THAT, or it was always intended to be a multipart group, the way Holostars Tempus seems to have been.

>Looking at the timeframe off the batch of european vtubers who
>graduated/announced hiatuses a few months ago, they likely had the
>audition wave being done around February at the latest. So while there
>was probably plans before then, the actual doings were probably after
>Dokibird reemerged and Niji started imploding under its own sheer mass
>of horseshit.
>
>That said, I also don't think Holo is rushing anything. Niji has long
>been accused of just shotgunning waves out three, four times a year.
>Justice is eleven months from Advent and I think they pushed it up
>largely because of how completely Advent has integrated.
>
>THAT, or it was always intended to be a multipart group, the way
>Holostars Tempus seems to have been.

It also helps that the interpretation of the statement in question I saw on another site now makes more sense in the context of Justice's announcement. The long and short of it is that Yagoo was saying that COVER's mid-to-long term plans (3-5 years) is to scale back major company expenses in light of the investments they've made in recent years (*cou2.5billionnewstudiogh*) and the focus will now be on paying down some of those investments, shoring up existing talent, and keeping to their planned debut schedule.

I wouldn't be surprised if the spin that he said "No need debuts" was in part due to antis who are bitter that Anycolor announced last week that NijiEN is basically on life support with management leaning heavily towards pulling the plug.

*watching FalseEyeD's latest video*

Not even debuted, and the flirting has already started...

-IA.

(received information not interpretable)

>*watching FalseEyeD's latest video*
>
>Not even debuted, and the flirting has already started...

Someone's done a quick compilation video of the early tweeting, the highlights of which are:

- Nerissa has it bad for Elizabeth and feeling seems mutual
- Biboo has already asked Elizabeth to adopt her so she can have a chunni last name and crushed Raora's hopes by admitting she probably won't be able to pronounce her name correctly.
- FuwaMoco have expressed interest in fluffing and biting Raora's tail.
- Shiori is being uncharacteristically controlled in her responses...so far.

As for the rest of the Holomems...

- Calli tried to sound British to Elizabeth, mistyped "crumpet," and immediately collapsed into cringe.
- Mumei and Fauna did it a bit better and still ended up sounding adorkable.
- Ollie's already added Roara to her harem, though she may regret that seeing as Raora had already adopted Kobo.

>- Calli tried to sound British to Elizabeth, mistyped
>"crumpet," and immediately collapsed into cringe.

In fairness, she did get the r in there, just... not in the right place.

--G.
She did that during a members-only stream. Her live reaction when half of chat questioned her spelling was even more horrified than the follow-up tweet she came across with.
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Fauna’s just happy to have another Green, I think~ she’s been the only one since The Thing Happened - despite Holo insisting that Mio’s color is green. :3

And of course, once again, Ame is out of town during a debut. She doesn’t like the joke, but it’s happened *every time*. Three or four is coincidence, but we’re at three times just with EN now. Is this someone at Cover doing some really indirect bullying, timing debuts to her vacations? :3

>- Nerissa has it bad for Elizabeth and feeling seems mutual

Day 1 log: Can't arrest, busy cuddling.
Day 2 log: Can't arrest, busy cuddling.
Day 3 log: Can't arrest, busy cuddling.
(...)

-IA.

(received information not interpretable)

If the guesses are right, Elizabeth will be a VERY good singer. Also she knew Nerissa beforehand, which might help the comfortableness of their banter.

Random thought out of the blue: If Elizabeth refers to Bae as "convict stock," is that her being a cop...or a Brit?

>Random thought out of the blue: If Elizabeth refers to Bae as "convict
>stock," is that her being a cop...or a Brit?

Yes.
--G.
and also a dick
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>Random thought out of the blue: If Elizabeth refers to Bae as "convict
>stock," is that her being a cop...or a Brit?

There's a joke in here about 'convict stock' being made by having a convict sit in hot water for a while, but I can't quite make it work...

-IA.

(fuwamoco's comments have cooking on my mind)

Oh god. I knew she'd be one of those women who laugh like that. No, thank you but no.

--G.
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>Oh god. I knew she'd be one of those women who laugh like
>that. No, thank you but no.

This one can sound like Ollie, in the same way that Mumei can sound like Gura.

--G.
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>>Oh god. I knew she'd be one of those women who laugh like
>>that. No, thank you but no.

The Ojou-sama/Noblewoman Laugh seemed to be a bit, alongside the more "regal" accent that makes her sound like the dub actress for Saber on Fate/Stay Night. The rest of the time, she sounded so generically "townie" that my American ear can't pin it down. To be honest, there were a couple times while listening to her that I thought "Is that Rin Penrose?"

>This one can sound like Ollie, in the same way that Mumei can sound
>like Gura.

She's a pretty amazing mimic, as she also did all the voices for the Advent girls and did a short "Takamori" bit that Papa Reaper was not amused by. I sense a great potential for trolling in this one.

>>This one can sound like Ollie, in the same way that Mumei can sound
>>like Gura.
>
>She's a pretty amazing mimic, as she also did all the voices for the
>Advent girls and did a short "Takamori" bit that Papa Reaper
>was not amused by. I
>sense a great potential for trolling in this one.

Oh, I was talking about Gigi by then. It's like livetweeting, but without even that rudimentary context. :)

I don't buy into the common gag that Mumei and Gura sound exactly alike, but they do have similar voices and can imitate each other pretty well. I suspect Gigi's and Ollie's voices have similarly common qualities.

--G.
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> She's a pretty amazing mimic, as she also did all the voices for the Advent girls

"Wait, that wasn't us??"

>Oh god. I knew she'd be one of those women who laugh like
>that. No, thank you but no.

Can't say she didn't warn you.

-IA.

(received information not interpretable)

>Oh god. I knew she'd be one of those women who laugh like
>that. No, thank you but no.

In fairness, she seems nice when she's not doing that. I hope it turns out to be one of those bits that fades away in practice.

Also, she's capable of being jumpscared by her own karaoke app, which bodes well for when she starts doing things that contain actual jumpscares. :)

--G.
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I imagine it'll stick around only for trolling purposes- I can see it being verrry effective as a surprise in open voice chats, especially against Nerissa.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Quick first impressions:

Elizabeth- She's extremely impressive, almost intimidating with her singing and voice skills. I'm not actually sure how much of her streams I'll actually watch as I'm already overloaded with stuff, but a round of applause nonetheless.

Gigi- My first thought was "Dokibird Lite" what with the cackling, the "I'm stupid" type of humor, and the just general maniacal nature. When they openly described her as a gremlin in her profile, I was wondering how she was going to live up to it, but I see I didn't need to worry.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Watching Gigi play Crazy Taxi and the "Dokibird lite" feeling is deepening between her voice and especially her laugh. I mean this in a good way, she's very fun to watch.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

>Gigi- My first thought was "Dokibird Lite" what with the cackling, the
>"I'm stupid" type of humor, and the just general maniacal nature. When
>they openly described her as a gremlin in her profile, I was wondering
>how she was going to live up to it, but I see I didn't need to worry.

It belatedly occurs to me to wonder how Gigi came to the profession of Incompetent Fantasy Policing from her people's traditional vocation, tampering with aircraft. Granted, the kids these days often eschew the traditions of their ancestors, but even so, that's quite a leap.

--G.
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"What do you mean 'down', are you stupid?!" German confirmed...

Live2D was not ready for violinists.

Well, she seems nice, and not at all inclined to engage in rampant gaslighting of chat for narrative purposes.

--G.
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She's adorable. Incredibly creative. I look forward to seeing more.

Her true power level will be when she gets full tracking for her hands, if she doesn't just do a flesh stream in the meantime.

Altare had a good 3D playing the cello, she'll blow him out of the water if given the opportunity.

It turns out that everything Cecilia does is for Justice!™

note: Justice™ may vary from the classical concept of "justice" in its applications and executions . . . mostly the executions.
"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

So we have Raora . . . everybody was speculating how easy it was going to be for Justice to catch Nerissasome of Advent, but I don't think anybody had "defecting to the side of the outlaws" on their bingo card. Well, "defecting to become an idol" is what she said, but potato, potato.

Speaking of potato . . . pizza with fries on it. I really have nothing to add to that.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Pizza with fries is pretty good, but I think Raora also likes sausage with them.

Or a good pesto..

--
Jen Dantes - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lady of Sith Tech Support.
"This may not be a good idea, but it's the only one I have."

I don't think I've ever seen anyone quit their previous job in the course of debuting before, that's a cute idea.

"Wow, there's a lot of violence (in the debuts) today." - Mori

Fries on pizza?! OK, I'ma have to try that. I had a calzone stuffed with fried mozzarella sticks once, that was... a thing. (Pete's Pizza in Waltham. They called it "Dick's Heart Attack", although Andrew Petrarca opined that they should'ver called it Dick's Heartburn.)

"phonk"? is that a real thing?

well, she seems very... Italian. :)

--G.
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> Fries on pizza?

For whatever reason, it really is a thing that Italians like. It just filters the rest of us.

Anyway, I'm actually most curious about her contract, because she graduated her previous identity but still wants to do real professional work. I hope she gets to keep the acknowledgements and associated future work if she does get professional contracts but has to graduate hololive in the future.

Well, noncompetes have been recently discovered to be wildly illegal, at least. But also, her ah, *previous job* didn't exactly really give a choice to quit, per se.

I can't/won't say more here, without a proper spoiler tag system, but If You Know.

Also, Calli's got a similar *problem* with her professional contracts. She's signed with UMG Japan(?) *As* Calliope Mori and not...anything else.

>Well, noncompetes have been recently discovered to be wildly illegal,
>at least. But also, her ah, *previous job* didn't exactly really give
>a choice to quit, per se.
>
>I can't/won't say more here, without a proper spoiler tag system, but
>If You Know.
>
>Also, Calli's got a similar *problem* with her professional contracts.
>She's signed with UMG Japan(?) *As* Calliope Mori and not...anything
>else.

Er...are you sure you're thinking of the right person? She had to graduate as a VTuber because Cover's contracts say you can't do non-them vtubing work while signed (aside from one specific person under a grandfathered contract). But she was independent, she didn't actually -have- to cease all activities on her previous identity, just stop vtubing. I guess without the model, she didn't want to do art any more, but I wouldn't be shocked to see her start occasionally posting again in a few months once things settle down or people let her know the loopholes or what have you.

LAST EDITED ON Jun-23-24 AT 03:17 AM (EDT)
 
Raora wasn't always independant, is what I'm talking about. In fact, until fairly recently, she wasn't. Though before that she also was. Again, not gonna say more *here*.

Any confusion is not knowing exactly what you meant, but I'm definitely thinking of Raora - The Pink One.

I brought up Calli because I thought you meant a career during/after Cover, which Calli may have a few problems with in a future that one hopes never comes to pass.

>Raora wasn't always independant, is what I'm talking about. In fact,
>until fairly recently, she wasn't. Though before that she also was.
>Again, not gonna say more *here*.
>
>Any confusion is not knowing exactly what you meant, but I'm
>definitely thinking of Raora - The Pink One.
>
>I brought up Calli because I thought you meant a career during/after
>Cover, which Calli may have a few problems with in a future that one
>hopes never comes to pass.

The whole thing was in reference to her stated goal that she wants to be a Vtuber mama (again) and get art into a gacha game AS Raora.

Aaahhhh.

Evening JP time slots. Welp, I'll never see her live... :/

--G.
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>I don't think I've ever seen anyone quit their previous job in the
>course of debuting before, that's a cute idea.

What’s even more amusing is that her ‘press conference’ announcing her change of career was to her mountain of chattcino plushies representing the chat.

—- Philip

	Philip J. Moyer Contributing Writer, Editor and Artist (and Moderator) -- Eyrie Productions, Unlimited CEO of MTS, High Poobah Of Artwork, and High Priest Of the Church Of Aerianne -- Magnetic Terrapin Studios "Insert Pithy Comment Here" Fandoms -- Fanart -- Fan Meta Discussions

>"phonk"? is that a real thing?

Amusingly, I then stumbled across a short asking the same question.

--G.
"They called that music?" "I mean... yeah? It goes insanely hard?"
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"Those were some of the dumbest words ever to come out of my mouth, but with that music, it's just so compelling."

Also a new twist on Goldfish Warning- smoke an enemy ship with a surprise attack and then dump the phonk into their audio channels?
"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

>Also a new twist on Goldfish Warning- smoke an enemy ship with
>a surprise attack and then dump the phonk into their audio
>channels?

Heck, "All Your Base" is almost a proto-phonk track in itself.

--G.
HOW ARE YOU GENTLEMEN
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That Zero Wing translation is truly iconic, a cultural touchstone of its time. (I once described myself as just getting on the Internet when "All Your Base" itself had mostly died down, but the snowclone "All your X are belong to us" was still very much in live use. I got a surprising number of "oh hey, me too!" responses.)

Random observation, but it's pretty amusing how the Justice girls have all opined since their debuts that they can't wait for the collab ban to be over. It must be killing them that their public interaction with the rest of the company is limited to tweets and watching each other's streams.

>Random observation, but it's pretty amusing how the Justice girls have
>all opined since their debuts that they can't wait for the collab ban
>to be over. It must be killing them that their public interaction
>with the rest of the company is limited to tweets and watching each
>other's streams.

ISTR hearing that Council's equivalent lasted an entire month, after which the company took a look at things and decided yeah, you know what, maybe they don't need that long to find their audiences. :)

--G.
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Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Council kind of accidentally broke the ban when Mumei and Gura ended up on the minecraft server together, and I think it broke the seal a little bit. Weakened it. I don't recall Advent having too much of a collab ban...was it only two weeks?

>I don't recall Advent having too much of a collab ban...was it only two weeks?

Something like that, which is about the same as no ban at all, practically speaking- it takes about that long to actually schedule collabs. Of course, with Kaela deciding Biboo was already Spoken For even before debut, the ban wasn't going to last long either way.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."