Well, this was a nice surprise to start my morning!

It's interesting to listen to Grissom and the ODSTs going over the ship - it makes it clear that they're utterly puzzled by what we know is going on. The little details like the font and the colors of the corridors were nice.

If this is Grissom post Jedi training (which is certainly what the rock climbing scene makes me think), I wonder just what he might have sensed with the Force when they looked her over.

Anyhow, veeeeery intereshting, and a good read.

I can think of at least 4 possibilities for where that phone call went. I'm sure they're all wrong, but I'm looking forward to finding out.

I concur. Great surprise this morning when I swung by the site to see if there was anything interesting in the forums. Glad I checked the What's New page first on a whim.

Can't wait for the next installment. So many questions will hopefully be answered, since this certainly raised a bunch.

Well, its certainly an interesting difference from the old version.

“They planned their campaigns just as you might make a splendid piece of harness. It looks very well; and answers very well; until it gets broken; and then you are done for. Now I made my campaigns of ropes. If anything went wrong, I tied a knot; and went on.”
-- Arthur Wellesley, First Duke of Wellington

My money on the phone call is 'Reporting to the BPOJK'.

>My money on the phone call is 'Reporting to the BPOJK'.

I was thinking about this, and at first, it's "Would they care?" (in addition to "Aren't they still spread from hell to breakfast with very little organization?")

And then I thought about it, and I can think of one sub-group that would be -VERY- interested, especially if they knew about Gryph touching the Force with his training in the Asagiri Kenjutsu. And it could explain why Gil has 'Disagreements' with Order in the 'Current' FI...

And now I'm really curious to see what happens after that phone call.

Um, the BPOJK - Babylon Project Order of the Jedi Knights (right?) doesn't exist yet because there is no WDF, Twlight, or Babylon Project.

That said, is he a Jedi Knight? Probably. My guess is he is reporting to an Authority like Asrial, Skuld, or W3A. It's clear he's been approached and asked to keep his eyes open. That he doesn't want his bosses to know. And he's been tasked to report on one man. He is a scientist working for cops and believes in justice - that suggests to me that someone with some precog ability found him and convinced him that reporting this sort of info back would lead to Justice.

my thoughts,
t.
who enjoys the mystery - but is annoyed by the whole "and we left her behind to give a message" bit because, y'know, subspace communications would be impossible, right?

trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - HST

>because, y'know, subspace communications
>would be impossible, right?

In this case you are absolutely correct. It would be quite impossible to convey the message Valeris carries via subspace radio.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

>>because, y'know, subspace communications
>>would be impossible, right?
>
>In this case you are absolutely correct. It would be quite
>impossible to convey the message Valeris carries via subspace
>radio.

Is this the sort of message that cannot be handed to the recipient, but can only be fired at them?

Shalon Wood

>>>because, y'know, subspace communications
>>>would be impossible, right?
>>
>>In this case you are absolutely correct. It would be quite
>>impossible to convey the message Valeris carries via subspace
>>radio.
>
>Is this the sort of message that cannot be handed to the
>recipient, but can only be fired at them?
>
Rather doubt that, its not G's style. Rather I'd assume it was some sort of mind meld message about the horror and carnage that happened aboard the Invincible when Kei jumped them, if that still happened and the damage was not, say, a result of the cross dimensional jump.

While Kei will certainly be hot on Gryphon's trail, I don't necessarily think we're going to see her attacking Invincible this time around. I believe I remarked a while back in another thread when we were discussing the problems with "Secrets" that I didn't see how Kei would be able, once Gryphon had been exonerated, to live with the knowledge of having killed hundreds of people whose only "crime" was to be crewpeople on G's ship; even with her post-Twilight changes, the psychic burden would still be very heavy on her. I suspect that Invincible got its damage somewhere else (maybe they were under attack before they made their dimensional jump?)

-Joe-

My thoughts

a) the attack on the Invincible may be what caused the demensional gateway/whatever.
b) Kei may be the one Gil sent his message to (as a core member of the WDF, there's probably a large Genom bounty on her head at this time, hence hiding in a nebula)
c) if the dimensional gateway was opened from the UF side, it could have been used to send a GENOM HK ship through in search of Gryphon
d) Gryphon and crew are probably keeping a low profile partly because he doesn't know how strong a grip Largo has on the UF-verse or what has happened since he left.

Well, then. Quite Impossible? I'm not quite as annoyed <grin>.

t.

Trigger Argee
trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - HST

The Benevolent and Protective Order of the Jedi Knights is thousands of years old, of course. Admittedly, at this point in the timeline it lacks organization, but given Grissom's known association with them they strike me as the most likely candidate.

>That said, is he a Jedi Knight? Probably. My guess is he is reporting
>to an Authority like Asrial, Skuld, or W3A. It's clear he's been
>approached and asked to keep his eyes open. That he doesn't want his
>bosses to know. And he's been tasked to report on one man. He is a
>scientist working for cops and believes in justice - that suggests to
>me that someone with some precog ability found him and convinced him
>that reporting this sort of info back would lead to Justice.

Or Megazone, or Edison Bell, Lord F, or as you note, one or more of the masters of the Jedi order. Just because right now they are dispersed and working individually doesnt mean that they dont stay in touch with each other... They are just very cautious about it to avoid leading anyone who might be after them to another of the order till UF G gets Master Windu to support the IPO idea and the order basicly comes back in out of the cold. Hell, It could even be someone on the Genom side of the fence, either to warn Largo, or just to know so maybe they could 'lead' Largo to his downfall, much like the claim of how you lead a pig.

(How do you lead a pig? You tie a string to its back leg and pull in the opposite direction of where you want it to go...)

Just for the record, I cannot believe I called Derek Bacon an Authority.

<sigh>,
t.
is hoping she's read the signs right.

Trigger Argee
trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me." - HST

The mahendosat would love him, I'm sure

Huh. Well, this is interesting. Questions off the top of my head:

1) Will we actually see what happened to the Invincible from their perspective? In a way I kind of hope we don't, keeping Gryphon and the rest of the Split Infinitive crew off-camera until the climax might be more interesting.

1a) Related to that, when we do get to the climax I hope RepliGryphon is still magnificently hammy. He was the best part of Secrets. ;)

2) What is Valeris' message? Who is it meant for? Obviously not the galaxy at large, or she would've spilled it already.

3) Who else is going to join the festivities?

--
Mr. Fnord

>1a) Related to that, when we do get to the climax I hope
>RepliGryphon is still magnificently hammy. He was the best part of
>Secrets. ;)

RepliGryph is actually Chairman Kaga's nephew.

Ard Collier
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace

Perfect.

--
Mr. Fnord
"How YOU doin'!?"

>2) What is Valeris' message? Who is it meant for? Obviously not the
>galaxy at large, or she would've spilled it already.

"You are the Harbinger of Death, Kei Morgan. You will lead them all to their end. End of line."

Mind blown.

Personally, I liked the Commanders name.. Soandso.. and the SDD results.. Mathematical nonsense.

LAST EDITED ON May-23-09 AT 06:02 AM (EDT)
 
> He pointed. "For instance, what do you make of the markings?"
> The corporal and his colleague both peered down at the ship.
>Presently, the lower-ranking one turned to Grissom and said hesitantly,
> "... They're in the wrong typeface?"

> "And," Grissom added, "look at these uniforms."
> Adaji nodded. "I've never seen anything like them, either. But
>the insignia's familiar enough," she added, pointing to the arrowhead
>badge on one dead spacer's red uniform jacket.

> The ship's bridge was much like the rest of it: superficially
>familiar, but upon closer examination, not quite right. It had the
>expected layout, but Grissom had never known a Federation starship's
>bridge to be so... white (...) with accents of royal blue and black-faced
>consoles.

Man, I hate those cheap knock-offs of licenced toys.

> "What kind of starship captain has the space below his quarters
>converted into a hangar for a single Veritech fighter?" he wondered
>rhetorically.

A better question would be: what kind of captain *doesn't*?

>> "What kind of starship captain has the space below his quarters
>>converted into a hangar for a single Veritech fighter?" he wondered
>>rhetorically.
>
>A better question would be: what kind of captain *doesn't*?

One who prefers fixed-configuration weapons?

>> "What kind of starship captain has the space below his quarters
>>converted into a hangar for a single Veritech fighter?" he wondered
>>rhetorically.
>
>A better question would be: what kind of captain *doesn't*?

Umm, most of them. Only captains that came up through the ranks as a Valk pilot would even consider it, and then only if they had a personal fighter and the pull with high command to allow it, really... I'd expect Pike or Kirk not to have a problem with it, but SI Cartwright probobly would, he comes off as having a real mean on for G in the SI universe

Well, having decided that having all of Manhunt in one piece needed a complete re read, I found myself drawing up one of the (only semi) dreaded stream of conciousness comentaries.

So, on to Part 1:
> A few hundred yards away, a shape at once immediately familiar
>and so out of place it momentarily defied recognition lay on the rocky,
>snow-draped ground, tilted toward them at a slight angle, its leading
>edge crushed into the face of a cliff.

Deanna, you hit the tree... again!

> "Is... is that what I think it is?" one of the ODSTs asked.
> "If you think it's the saucer section from a Constitution-class
>Federation starship, then... yes," the passenger replied.
> "What's it doing here?" the ODST wondered.

a really bad job of parking, but a great job of getting down in one piece!

>You didn't send Orbital
>Drop Shock Troopers, men and women trained to be the very tip of the
>point of the Royal Salusian Marine Corps spear, to investigate something
>like this, let alone to nursemaid some... -civilian-.

Ah, but Grissom is no ORDINARY civilian.

> "That doesn't make any sense," the other ODST, a woman,
>objected. "What Starfleet captain would just sit around with his
>shields down and let somebody tag him at least three times?"
> "One who didn't have a choice," the corporal declared.

Sort of a Duh comment, but it so sets up the rest of this nicely...

> "Main power failure?" Orman hazarded. Sorenzu nodded
>agreement.

or sabotauge, though clearly the ODST's have no reason to think
that way. I wonder if the though momentarily crosses Grissom's
mind, or if he, like me, so buys into the happy happy joy joy
version of the Fleet that one doesnt think ANYONE would consider
such a thing?

>"We've had some unconfirmed reports of pirate activity in the area.
>It's not too likely, but it's just possible that we're not as alone on
>Xawin as we think."

You've got the saucer section from a ship who's normal contingent is like
500 people there Adaji! Unless they all died in the crash (or have grabbed
a pirate vessel and fled) it's pretty damn certain your not alone down there!

> "I've spoken to the Starfleet Bureau of Ships - their equivalent
>to the Royal Navy's Construction and Commissioning Office. There -is-
>no USS Invincible. No Starfleet vessel has ever had that name. Second
>fact: Our mystery ship's hull number, nebula comet comet one seven one
>seven, belongs to a ship that was destroyed 50 years ago."

Heh. Gee, a ship with slightly different markings bearing a name that
the RNCCO would be more likely to use than 'Fleet and the number of a
ship lost 50 years ago. Gee, just what COULD that mean?

> "I suspect the truth in this case will turn out to be simpler...
>and stranger." Grissom got up. "I need to get aboard that ship. There
>may be answers in there - and possibly survivors who need help."

again, a DUH, but still so well done one doesnt care!

> "Whatever the specifics mean," Grissom mused, "the fact that
>they're wearing uniforms at all tells us one important fact." He made
>eye contact with Adaji and went on, "These people were professionals."

Not only professionals, but professionals with sufficent discipline and
esprit d'corps that NOT looking after their dead shipmates with an eye
too eventual retrieval and proper internment is as alien as the insides
of Hunter S. Thompson's head...

> "A computer that size couldn't be powerful enough to operate an
>entire starship," objected Orman.

That would be because you've not run across the true power of Clueless,
Corporal. Actually quite understandable, given that you were probobly
just past the pottie training stage "When the Fun stopped"

> Grissom nodded. "Warp core rupture," he said.
> "That's how we read it. That ship entered the system with a
>serious drive malfunction, and just outside the city limits, so to
>speak, it looks like they went over the high side."

BIIIIG Boom... of course the question stands was it a deliberate act
of retuning the engines for a jump, or was it a
VERY lucky side effect of the hits they took in the pre jump fight?

> The ship's bridge was much like the rest of it: superficially
>familiar, but upon closer examination, not quite right. It had the
>expected layout, but Grissom had never known a Federation starship's
>bridge to be so... white. Not that it was so obvious that it -was-
>white, with all the streaks of soot and other clear indications, as if
>any more were needed, that this ship had been in a fight; but white it
>was, with accents of royal blue and black-faced consoles.

Only thing that isnt clear here is if we are talking about 'Abrams' type
layout or TMP type layout. Not that it really matters except when one
keeps trying to insist its one over the other...

> "Starfleet Medical maintains a complete DNA database of serving
>officers and crew," he explained to Orman as he swabbed what he thought,
>assuming the consoles in this bridge were laid out as he expected, was
>the weapons officer's station.

Oh. I take it back, clearly its the infamouse "Mode select" movie style;
its the only layout that had a separate weapons officer station.

> "Mm. But the seat's internal tractors must still have been
>working," Grissom said. "Otherwise, the captain would've gone straight
>into the main viewer on impact. This seat doesn't have physical
>restraints."

Damn nice touch that explains why people DONT go flying all over the
the bridge when they get slammed around, since TMP is the only movie that
showed ANY of the seats having ANY sort of restraints!

> "The captain's safe is empty, it was standing open," Orman said.
>"But that's not the odd part.

True. If they had time to dismount the commissioning plaque
the captain should well have had time to clean out his safe, which would
have been SOP from back when navies sailed the briny blue rathe than the
depths of space.

>The odd part is that there's another keypad inside it."

Yeah, I could see that NOT being standard unless it came from a REALLY
paranoid culture.

> "What kind of starship captain has the space below his quarters
>converted into a hangar for a single Veritech fighter?" he wondered
>rhetorically.

One who both has a Valk and someone who's used to having to make real quick
escapes over the past 90 some years...

> "None," Grissom said. "And what's more, no Corellians, no
>Zardons, nobody of Zentraedi extraction, and no one showing any signs of
>21st-century Earth's colonization engineering"

such as if earth was in the middle of a super soldier war instead of fitting
colonists to planets at that time...

>WANTED FOR: MURDER (MASS)
> MURDER (MULTIPLE)
> MURDER (SERIAL)
> RAPE
> KIDNAPPING
> GRAND THEFT
> ARMED ROBBERY
> AGGRAVATED ASSAULT
> AGGRAVATED ASSAULT UPON A POLICE OFFICER
> IMPERSONATING A POLICE OFFICER
> IMPERSONATING A MILITARY OFFICER
> IMPERSONATING AN AGENT OF THE CROWN
> UNLAWFUL FLIGHT TO AVOID PROSECUTION
> EVADING PURSUIT
> RESISTING ARREST
> USE OF FALSE IDENTITY DOCUMENTS
> USE OF FALSE STARSHIP REGISTRY DOCUMENTS
> POSSESSION OF CONTROLLED TECHNOLOGIES
> LESE MAJESTE

Lese Majeste? Who'd Repli Gryph dis???

> "Mm. Courtesy of our civic-minded friends at the GENOM
>Corporation," Grissom added dryly. "What puzzles me is, if that -was-
>Benjamin Hutchins's ship, and someone shot it down... why has that
>someone not come forward to claim this reward?"

cause they're on the wrong side of the dimensional barrier... or worse.

> "I'm all ears, Commander," Grissom said.

a statement that will be doubly ironic once he gets Humanized...

> It's almost like somebody set off an SDD out there,
>but no wormhole."

IOW, the aftermath of a dimensional crossover, intentional or otherwise...

>he would endeavor not to ride in an M29 Grizzly again

The Grizzly AFV is from Halo? which if not?

>was the distinctive
>blocky shape of an Ares Corporation Landmaster hostile environment
>vehicle.

the one from the Movie version of Damnation Alley, right?

>Inner door, same story."
>
> Sorenzu had seen the way Starfleet Marines operated. It wasn't
>so different from the way the RSMC did things, come to that.

A perfect, all but seemless transition into the sort of monochromed
"this is what happened" sort of reconstrutive shot CSI is now soo well know for
just as much as the TMI cam...

>Then, elevating her chin slightly, she said in a clear voice, "Valeris.
>Lieutenant, Starfleet, MX39352769."
> "This isn't a military interrogation, Lieutenant," Grissom told
>her.

Maybe not, but you asked who she was and she answered.

>There's also the
>interesting fact that you were left behind. Why was that?"
> Valeris hesitated, then said, "I have a message."
> "What message?"
> She shook her head. "It is not for you."
> "Well, who -is- it for?"
> Her face shut down again.

Not you, and apparently she doesnt want to say for who...
Or has been ordered, or has a clue that whoever it was...
isnt someone she should be mentioning to legal beagles,
err, Squirrls...

>I'm reasonably certain it was a Telgorn DX-9 military
>transport

Did you just pull this out of your increadible creativity,
or is it an image reference I'm just not parsing?

> "She's a material witness - "
> "To -what?-

To what is going to be the biggest paradigm shift in galactic power structures
since Sonset....

> "Grissom reporting," he said. "Positive indications he was on
>Xawin, in the Strenuus system, within the last two weeks. He's not
>there now, current whereabouts still unknown. Unable to provide further
>information at this time. Full report to follow."

Now that its all in the can, Who was it that Grissom was reporting too?
Meh, I guess it really doesnt matter, though now I have a serious suspicion
it was her royal nibs, given that she commisioned Mars Division to help her
investigate, something they were already doing...

>or sabotauge, though clearly the ODST's have no reason to think
>that way.

Well, it's a possibility, but even then, it's still main power failure. It's a bit like saying death was caused by heart failure. It almost always is, in some form or another. :)

>Only thing that isnt clear here is if we are talking about 'Abrams'
>type
>layout or TMP type layout. Not that it really matters except when one
>keeps trying to insist its one over the other...

If Invincible had been an ST2009 Constitution-class, they'd have known something was amiss long before they saw the strange markings. The Enterprise in the new movie is frickin' huge - bigger than the Enterprise-E from the last three TNG movies. Crew of a thousand or more, around half a mile long. The saucer section alone would be visibly and obviously much larger than anything the Starfleet of UF-2380 has in its TO&E.

>> "Mm. But the seat's internal tractors must still have been
>>working," Grissom said. "Otherwise, the captain would've gone straight
>>into the main viewer on impact. This seat doesn't have physical
>>restraints."
>
>Damn nice touch that explains why people DONT go flying all over the
>the bridge when they get slammed around

Thank you, though I must admit I got the idea from the description of that yellow airspeeder in the Star Wars Episode II visual encyclopedia. (Or maybe it was Incredible Cross-Sections. I forget.)

>> LESE MAJESTE
>
>Lese Majeste? Who'd Repli Gryph dis???

Unclear; that may be a reference to the fact that, as a Knight of the Salusian Crown, any untoward conduct of which the real G is suspected is automatically an insult to said Crown.

>>he would endeavor not to ride in an M29 Grizzly again
>
>The Grizzly AFV is from Halo? which if not?

No, Mass Effect. The model before the Mako. They turn up now and then as static background items (several places on the ice planet, for instance, you find burning M29s by the side of the road).

>>was the distinctive
>>blocky shape of an Ares Corporation Landmaster hostile environment
>>vehicle.
>
>the one from the Movie version of Damnation Alley, right?

Correct.

>> Sorenzu had seen the way Starfleet Marines operated. It wasn't
>>so different from the way the RSMC did things, come to that.
>
>A perfect, all but seemless transition into the sort of monochromed
>"this is what happened" sort of reconstrutive shot CSI is now soo well
>know for

Thanks, that's pretty much what I was aiming for there. :)

>>I'm reasonably certain it was a Telgorn DX-9 military
>>transport
>
>Did you just pull this out of your increadible creativity,
>or is it an image reference I'm just not parsing?

Stormtrooper transport from the old TIE Fighter game.

>Now that its all in the can, Who was it that Grissom was reporting
>too?

I always figured it was Maia, or at least a voice mailbox Maia had access to.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

>>Only thing that isnt clear here is if we are talking about 'Abrams'
>>type
>>layout or TMP type layout. Not that it really matters except when one
>>keeps trying to insist its one over the other...
>
>If Invincible had been an ST2009 Constitution-class,
>they'd have known something was amiss long before they saw the strange
>markings. The Enterprise in the new movie is frickin'
>huge - bigger than the Enterprise-E from the last three TNG
>movies. Crew of a thousand or more, around half a mile long. The
>saucer section alone would be visibly and obviously much larger than
>anything the Starfleet of UF-2380 has in its TO&E.

....*blink*
Really? 'cause, uh, the impression I'd gotten from the ST2009 version was that it was, if anything, smaller than the original style.
Granted, I had no numbers to work with to give it any appreciable sense of size that wasn't purely relative, but still. It seemed smaller to me all the same. Something about the hull-wide shuttlebay opening, I suspect,

>Really?

That's what they tell me. (In the face of conflicting reports, I'm going with the one from the official website, 2,500 feet.)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Hard to say whether this is a case of Did Not Do The Research or one-upsmanship ("ours is bigger").

There are many things I like about the new movie, mostly involving certain principal actors. And there are other things, mostly involving the production design...

Can't fault the FX work, though. :)

>Hard to say whether this is a case of Did Not Do The Research or
>one-upsmanship ("ours is bigger").

There are other options, but they do not appeal to the miffed-fandom mind. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

> It seemed
>smaller to me all the same. Something about the hull-wide shuttlebay
>opening, I suspect

That hull-wide shuttlebay opening revealed a bay capable of holding something like twenty standard TOS shuttles, as opposed to the original's two or three max.

--The Evil Midnight Lurker what Lurks at Midnight
"An object at rest--CANNOT BE STOPPED!!!"