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Subject: "Manhunt 6" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Matrix Dragon
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May-31-09, 04:14 AM (EST)
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"Manhunt 6"
 
   Okay, as if it wasn't awesome enough already, you blended the original events of Secrets into this one. The moment I realized what Saras role in this was, a huge grin went onto my face. The battle, the dialogue, Val taking Jaimies place (With another great movie reference), the ministers stupidity taking him down and Grissom NEARLY drawing his weapon again... onto the trial and Kei's appearance... This was epic.

Great ride Gryph. I'm kinda sorry it's over now. But DAMN, it was fun!

Matrix Dragon, J. Random Nutter


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Manhunt 6 Mister Fnord May-31-09 1
  RE: Manhunt 6 drakensis May-31-09 2
  RE: Manhunt 6 BeardedFerret May-31-09 3
  RE: Manhunt 6 Meagen May-31-09 4
  RE: Manhunt 6 Polychrome May-31-09 5
     RE: Manhunt 6 jadmire May-31-09 6
         RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin May-31-09 12
  RE: Manhunt 6 jadmire May-31-09 7
     RE: Manhunt 6 SpottedKitty May-31-09 8
     RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin May-31-09 11
     RE: Manhunt 6 Droken May-31-09 13
         RE: Manhunt 6 Ardaniel May-31-09 21
             RE: Manhunt 6 Star Ranger4 Jun-01-09 33
                 RE: Manhunt 6 Meagen Jun-02-09 36
  RE: Manhunt 6 BZArchermoderator May-31-09 9
  RE: Manhunt 6 Star Ranger4 May-31-09 10
  RE: Manhunt 6 Edenclaw May-31-09 14
  RE: Manhunt 6 Droken May-31-09 15
  RE: Manhunt 6 WengFook May-31-09 16
     RE: Manhunt 6 Berk May-31-09 17
         RE: Manhunt 6 Terminus Est Jun-01-09 25
             RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-01-09 26
  RE: Manhunt 6 Matrix Dragon May-31-09 18
     RE: Manhunt 6 Prince Charon May-31-09 20
         RE: Manhunt 6 dstar May-31-09 22
             RE: Manhunt 6 McFortner May-31-09 23
             RE: Manhunt 6 BeardedFerret May-31-09 24
  RE: Manhunt 6 Prince Charon May-31-09 19
  RE: Manhunt 6 CdrMike Jun-01-09 27
  RE: Manhunt 6 Sofaspud Jun-01-09 28
     RE: Manhunt 6 Croaker Jun-01-09 29
         RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-01-09 31
     RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-01-09 30
         RE: Manhunt 6 Terminus Est Jun-01-09 32
             RE: Manhunt 6 Offsides Jun-06-09 45
  RE: Manhunt 6 Star Ranger4 Jun-02-09 34
     RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-02-09 35
  RE: Manhunt 6 Barricade Jun-05-09 37
     RE: Manhunt 6 Rickdominated Jun-05-09 38
         RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-05-09 40
     RE: Manhunt 6 Gryphonadmin Jun-05-09 39
         RE: Manhunt 6 Star Ranger4 Jun-05-09 41
             RE: Manhunt 6 Prince Charon Jun-05-09 42
                 RE: Manhunt 6 Peter Eng Jun-05-09 43
         RE: Manhunt 6 jadmire Jun-05-09 44
  RE: Manhunt 6 inklesspen Jun-08-09 46
     RE: Manhunt 6 BZArchermoderator Jun-08-09 48
         RE: Manhunt 6 Wedge Jun-08-09 49
  RE: Manhunt 6 Silent Soul Jun-08-09 47

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Mister Fnord
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May-31-09, 04:30 AM (EST)
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1. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   The Butcher's best lines survived the stalinization process. I am content.

Well played, gang. Well played indeed.

--
Mr. Fnord


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drakensis
Member since Dec-20-06
315 posts
May-31-09, 05:37 AM (EST)
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2. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   > “That is an invoice to the GENOM Corporation, claiming the two hundred fifty
> million Standard credits the company has promised to the person who
> apprehends the Butcher of Musashi. It will be submitted the moment HN1’s
> trial is complete - which I am assured will be no later than Monday.”

That's just gold.

Much the same could be said for the rest of the story, of course.

I do have to wonder if Nogura was simply doing his job - being a bastard - as best he could, or if he was one of the sincere believers that Gryphon was guilty. In either case, I can't see him being the sort of prosecutor to voluntarily shake hands with the defendant later, given his later appearances.

D.


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BeardedFerret
Member since Apr-21-08
514 posts
May-31-09, 06:18 AM (EST)
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3. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   This, and by extension the entire Manhunt series, is easily the best Eyrie story I've read. Thank you for pouring so much effort into it and congratulations on making something so brilliant.

Also:

"Shh! Jesus, Saavik. Not yet," Gryphon replied, shaking his
head. He looked around for some wood to touch, but was thwarted by the
future.

Gold.


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Meagen
Member since Jul-14-02
551 posts
May-31-09, 07:47 AM (EST)
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4. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   >his face - which would probably have been reasonably
>handsome, for an Earthman's, if it hadn't been smeared with blood -
>lifted in delight.
> "Hello!" he said happily. "Dessert!"

I wonder if this didn't contribute - at least subconsciously - to the misgivings Sara had when she met Gryphon the next time in her life.

Grissom doesn't pull his weapon for the... uh, zeroth time onscreen.

> Valeris stared straight into his remaining eye, and he noticed
>that her two pupils weren't quite the same size. She smiled as sweetly
>as a person in her situation could smile.
> "I. Have. Your knife," she said.

When you steal only the good bits, it's called "homage". :)

> "Do I really... -pause- like that?" Kirk wondered when McCoy had
>control of himself again.

This broke me completely.

> "Well, Captain Hutchins," said Kirk, raising a glass, "you're a
>free man. What are your plans?"
> "I don't know," Gryphon admitted. "I think first I might go
>back to Salusia and ask that cute Kumbari air traffic controller to
>dinner."
> Kirk's hazel eyes twinkled. "I hate to disappoint you, Captain,
>but she's already got plans the next time Enterprise is in the system."

Oh, Kirk. (I still say he needs to dangle from some ledges, but hey, plenty of time for that.)

Overall, I liked it a lot.

--
With great power come great perks.


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Polychrome
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May-31-09, 08:19 AM (EST)
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5. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   The dialogue for Kirk, McCoy, and Spcok in particular was fabulous an spot on character. Whatever it is that y'all are doing to find a character's voice, keep it up 'cause it's working.

Also, I can't help but wonder if Valeris is one of the founders of the Charismatic Vulcan movement.

Polychrome


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jadmire
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May-31-09, 09:10 AM (EST)
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6. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #5
 
   To my own mind, somewhat doubtful, if Spock's elder brother Sybok exists in the UFverse (I *think* he in fact does, though I can't remember where I read that particular fiddly bit; I do remember that the good people of Palon'shar, in the Vulcan arctic regions, had as much to do with it, as they never adopted Surak's philosophy of extreme emotional control like other Vulcans). I should think Valeris would by all means become influential in the movement, though.

-Joe-


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Gryphonadmin
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May-31-09, 01:07 PM (EST)
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12. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #6
 
   >To my own mind, somewhat doubtful, if Spock's elder brother Sybok
>exists in the UFverse (I *think* he in fact does, though I can't
>remember where I read that particular fiddly bit; I do remember that
>the good people of Palon'shar, in the Vulcan arctic regions, had as
>much to do with it, as they never adopted Surak's philosophy of
>extreme emotional control like other Vulcans).

Sybok does, or did, exist (I have no data on whether he's still alive in 2410); several members of The Illogics (formerly Cthia) are followers of the Way of Sybok, though presumably not to the extent of... whatever it was that drove Sybok to become a kind of cheerful terrorist, I forget offhand. (One of them mocks his movement's own catchphrase when hitting on Dorothy: "So, baby, what's your secret pain?")

The Palon'shartha don't completely eschew Surak; their attitude toward him is not unlike what I've read about the attitude of moderate Islam to Christ. He was a great man, a prophet and teacher, to be reverenced and admired, but he was not the ultimate authority on everything. They prefer to interpret his writings on emotion as an exhortation to get ahold of themselves and "be excellent to each other," rather than, to use T'Vek's slightly (and consciously) unfair phrase, "Pretend you're a robot, it's the only hope." :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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jadmire
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May-31-09, 09:57 AM (EST)
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7. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   I think it's fairly obvious what an upcoming project for our artists should be; portraying Sara and Grissom at the time of these events! I assume that this is before they undergo humanization? And the first meeting of Sara and Spock....awwww. It seems that Ms. Sidle will have not one, but two, mentors in the UFverse.

Incidentally, kudos for taking all the good parts from the climax of "Secrets" and retooling them for this new version. I'm not nearly as familiar with the CSI source material as I should be, so I don't know if source-Sara was homeless/a foster-home football as a child, but it's a good backstory for her, and as others have noted, it lends an extra dimension to her initial wariness of Gryphon when they meet again in 2409.

Extra points for the use of the word "bint" (I collect, from the credits, that that's Ardie's doing.) The only other place I'd come across it before was in S.M. Stirling's alternate-history novel _The Peshawar Lancers_; I suppose the Butcher must have spent some time on a Hindustani-speaking world. And a nice not-so-ironic echo by Kei when she gave her case-clinching testimony...

Old version, Gryphon's reaction to the Butcher's rant was...well, kind of corny. This time, it's short, sharp and entirely to the point. And I'm very happy indeed to see that Valeris has redeemed herself. I have no idea whether she'll go back into Starfleet, join the WDF, the IPSF or the CFMF, or perhaps just go independent spacer, but I'm quite sure we haven't seen the last of her!

Brilliant handling of Gryphon's surrender (including Kirk's gentlemanly behavior) and trial, so much more so than the old version (which seemed way rushed to me); I enjoyed seeing the good Commodore Stone from "Court Martial" - and BTW, was Jim Kirk tried on the same charges arising from the same incident in the UFverse, or something different? - and Dr. Boyce. I know Nogura was really just doing his job, but did he have to be so nasty about it? H'mmmm...if that's the measure of his personality, and he became Starfleet CINC soon thereafter, there must have been one hell of a lot of personality conflicts which helped impel Kirk and his friends (and Dr. Boyce as well, for I recall that he was - for a little while, anyway - the WDF's surgeon general, hence the name of New Avalon's premier hospital) to decamp for greener pastures. Spock may not have a law degree, but he can defend me anytime, especially if he puts Jim's (in)famous speechifying pattern from "The Omega Glory" to such good use.

"A cup of tea with you, sir..." Hee hee. A glass of wine with you, sir; the virtual bottle stands by you. (I was remiss in not noting Gryphon's use of Jack Aubrey's signature catch-phrase "There is not a moment to be lost!" earlier.) I assume the Surprises mix their grog according to the time-honored formula, under the grave and attentive scrutiny of the crew? :)

I heartily concur; this epic deserves its own sub-page!

-Joe-


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SpottedKitty
Member since Jun-15-04
495 posts
May-31-09, 11:22 AM (EST)
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8. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #7
 
   >I know Nogura was really just doing his
>job, but did he have to be so nasty about it? H'mmmm...if that's the
>measure of his personality, and he became Starfleet CINC soon
>thereafter, there must have been one hell of a lot of personality
>conflicts which helped impel Kirk and his friends <...> to decamp
> for greener pastures.

Possibly not Trek canon, but I remember some of the Pocket Books novels pick up on a few lines that I think were in the novelisation of ST:TMP but not the film. Yes, Nogura — as a Starfleet admiral — is just as much a pain in the caudal appendage as he is here.

All in all, a great rewrite, and I really like the way so many bits of Secrets ended up still working well in Manhunt. I actually liked and enjoyed the original version, but this, with the expanded cast and playground of the current UF-verse, is even better.

--
Unable to save the day: File is read-only.


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Gryphonadmin
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May-31-09, 01:02 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #7
 
   >I think it's fairly obvious what an upcoming project for our artists
>should be; portraying Sara and Grissom at the time of these events! I
>assume that this is before they undergo humanization?

Well before, in Sara's case; we know from remarks in Parallel Lines that she remained in her natural state until she went to Vulcan for grad school, more than 20 years after this.

>And the first
>meeting of Sara and Spock....awwww. It seems that Ms. Sidle will have
>not one, but two, mentors in the UFverse.

Now we know how she got into the Vulcan Science Academy (well, apart from just being brilliant). :)

>I'm not nearly as
>familiar with the CSI source material as I should be, so I don't know
>if source-Sara was homeless/a foster-home football as a child, but
>it's a good backstory for her

I don't think there's anything in the original about her having lived on the streets, but she was definitely a foster child for some time. The bit about her mother having killed her father and gone to prison is straight from the source.

>and as others have noted, it lends an
>extra dimension to her initial wariness of Gryphon when they meet
>again in 2409.

I was very careful to set it up so that they never properly meet, and she doesn't ever really see his face (albeit the Butcher's looks just the same); I'm sure she read about the incident later in life and knows she must have seen him there, but by the time she meets him as an adult, the memory of the whole thing has taken on a certain dreamlike quality. It was, after all, quite a traumatic experience. She remembers meeting Grissom and Spock with high clarity, but the rest has blurred quite a bit.

>And a nice not-so-ironic echo by Kei when
>she gave her case-clinching testimony...

I'm assuming she watched Edison's report as it was happening, and the word stuck in her unconscious mind; to her, the Butcher's little indictment was damningly accurate, for all that it was delivered by a frothing-mad rogue robot.

>Old version, Gryphon's reaction to the Butcher's rant was...well, kind
>of corny. This time, it's short, sharp and entirely to the point.

The part of me that remains forever a 12-year-old who likes Steven Seagal movies writhes with delight at the "Hey. Shut the fuck up." sequence. :)

>I'm very happy indeed to see that Valeris has redeemed herself.

The only thing that bothered me a little about casting her in that bit of the action was that it robbed Jamie of a bit of a moment, but given that she had the phaser-fire bit in 5 and the brainstorm about the torpedo in the frontispiece of 6, I figured her reputation would survive. :)

>Brilliant handling of Gryphon's surrender (including Kirk's
>gentlemanly behavior)

I enjoyed that bit; we don't get to see that side of Captain Kirk much in the old series (mostly because the other starship captains who appear in TOS are usually there to be raging incompetents of one sort or another), but he does have that old-fashioned streak that I figured would show in a thing like his treatment of someone he considers a brother officer. (And, as noted in 5, he knows what a rare and admirable thing a human able to command the loyalty of a Vulcan is.)

>the old version (which seemed way rushed to me)

Oh, it was. By the time I got there, back then, I'd gotten the parts I considered important - q.v. The Action - finished, and I just wanted to have the rest of it over. I had little love for Talky Scenes back then. :)

>I enjoyed seeing the good Commodore
>Stone from "Court Martial" - and BTW, was Jim Kirk tried on the same
>charges arising from the same incident in the UFverse, or something
>different?

It was the same incident, and if I'd had time, I'd have mentioned that seeing an adult, uniformed Jamie handling a phaser rifle with that kind of authority in a firefight gave Jim a bit of pause; but then, it's entirely possible that he didn't recognize her, given that he wouldn't have been looking for an adult counterpart to a disgraced old friend's teenage daughter, and in the end I didn't really see a place to put it that didn't have the obvious feel of "the producers wanted us to mention this" about it.

Commodore Stone comes off as a bit of an ass here, but then, in "Court Martial" he instantly switches from Friendly Starbase Guy to baldly calling Kirk a perjurer and a murderer when Spock hands him the data card, so we know he has a habit of snap judgments. His was the one face on the tribunal that made Spock think, This could be trouble.

(As an aside, we also saw Admiral Fitzpatrick on the original show. He was the admiral in "The Trouble with Tribbles". "And remember, Captain - you're in good hands with tribbles.")

>and Dr. Boyce. I know Nogura was really just doing his
>job, but did he have to be so nasty about it?

Commodore (later Admiral) Nogura is blessed with a naturally abrasive personality; he has the interesting distinction of being the only active Starfleet flag officer to have suffered a mutiny while a starship captain, all owing to his treatment of junior officers, which he considered character-building discipline and which they (and a board of inquiry, though it did no lasting damage to his career) saw as hazing. He has a low opinion of anyone he considers an anarchist, a libertine, or a boozer, and as far as his reading of the history books (which during his childhood were heavily influenced by the GENOM PR machine), the old-timey Wedge Defenders were all three. Also - and if the Judge Advocate General's office had screened his personnel file a little more carefully they'd have caught this and recused him for a conflict of interest - though he himself is from Tomodachi, there was a branch of his family in Musashi City before the Fall.

>"A cup of tea with you, sir..." Hee hee. A glass of wine with you,
>sir; the virtual bottle stands by you.

Ah! I forgot to include the natural converse, "Mr. Spock, the teapot stands by you." I believe, since the file is still technically open until this evening, I shall go and add that. :)

>I assume the Surprises mix their grog
>according to the time-honored formula, under the grave and attentive
>scrutiny of the crew? :)

Of course, though the alcohol is entirely optional; some members of the crew, unlike eighteenth-century man-of-war's men, are teetotal. (Vanessa, for instance, never touches the stuff after a deeply embarrassing karaoke incident on Qo'noS.)

I find it intriguing to consider that the Vulcan language has a word for "grog". I suspect Gryphon of a certain license in translation there. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Droken
Member since May-6-08
340 posts
May-31-09, 01:10 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #7
 
   >Extra points for the use of the word "bint" (I collect, from the
>credits, that that's Ardie's doing.) The only other place I'd come
>across it before was in S.M. Stirling's alternate-history novel _The
>Peshawar Lancers_

I also give points for using "bint". I heard it first thanks to good ol' Monty Python and the Holy Grail: "If I went 'round, sayin' I was an Emperor, just because some moistened -bint- lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me -away-!"

-Droken

"If at first you don't succeed, bull-
riding is not for you."


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Ardaniel
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May-31-09, 06:45 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #13
 
   >I also give points for using "bint". I heard it first thanks to good
>ol' Monty Python and the Holy Grail: "If I went 'round, sayin' I was
>an Emperor, just because some moistened -bint- lobbed a scimitar at
>me, they'd put me -away-!"

I'm pretty sure I first heard it in an Anne McCaffrey novel. In the specific case of this story, I read the draft, turned to Gryph, and said "I think Kei might be a bint instead of a wench."

Ard Collier
that Janice chick
Usual Suspect and general menace


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Star Ranger4
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Jun-01-09, 11:43 PM (EST)
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33. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #21
 
   >"I think Kei might be a bint instead of a wench."
>
Huh... I think I shall need to excercise a bit of google fu now, as I'm still unclear as to the difference, save that in this case they were both meant to be degredatory perjoratives.


Of COURSE you wernt expecting it!
No One expects the FANNISH INQUISITION!
RCW# 86


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Meagen
Member since Jul-14-02
551 posts
Jun-02-09, 05:35 AM (EST)
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36. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #33
 
   >>"I think Kei might be a bint instead of a wench."
>>
>Huh... I think I shall need to excercise a bit of google fu now, as
>I'm still unclear as to the difference, save that in this case they
>were both meant to be degredatory perjoratives.

For me, "wench" brings to mind renfaires and D&D sessions where you demand "ale and wenches" in exchange for last session's loot.

--
With great power come great perks.


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BZArchermoderator
Member since Nov-9-05
1668 posts
May-31-09, 11:27 AM (EST)
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9. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   The whole thing just has a fantastic energy that never lets up, and wouldn't let me go.

Thanks, Ben. You did really, really good.

---------------------------
Matt "BZArcher" Wagner
@BZArcher / bzarcher at gmail
"Here's an itemized list of 30
years of disagreements!"


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Star Ranger4
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May-31-09, 12:03 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   I have nothing I can add that the others havent said already.

I think I shall just go back and re read it all again and revel in it.


Of COURSE you wernt expecting it!
No One expects the FANNISH INQUISITION!
RCW# 86


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Edenclaw
Member since Jun-4-15
7 posts
May-31-09, 01:10 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   Just wanted to chime in with my own opinions of the awesomeness of this storyline. Nothing really to say that hasn't been said already, so 'Thanks for a great read' will have to do.

It was good enough to drag me out of lurkerdom :(third time I've had to reboot this poor neglected account).

-Eden


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Droken
Member since May-6-08
340 posts
May-31-09, 01:16 PM (EST)
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15. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   Words fail me, aside from noting the sheer, indescribable power of Manhunt. I started reading it at 8am this morning, and was nearly late to my Master's course because I didn't want to stop reading. My hat off to you Gryph, that was utterly spectacular.

-Droken

"If at first you don't succeed, bull-
riding is not for you."


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WengFook
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May-31-09, 02:31 PM (EST)
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16. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
  
First of all a job well done. Very well done sir. The salvaged lines the Butcher spouts are blended in a totally believable manner and the part where Gryphon gets even for 92 years of grief felt right and I nearly died laughing at the redneck katana description. I was a little disappointed we never actually see Asrial onscreen interacting with Gryphon after the bridge and subsequent beatdown of the Butcher but I suppose it wouldn't have contributed much to the story anyways :)

I'm a little curious about the similarities between Sara and Juniper's backstory, is there some reference you're making with the little-homeless-girl-who-finds-a-phaser-and-uses-it-for-lighting-purposes schtick?

_____________________________________________
"Walls are meant to be broken." - makes sense both figuratively and literally.


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Berk
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May-31-09, 04:24 PM (EST)
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17. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #16
 
   > is there some reference you're making with the
> little-homeless-girl-who-finds-a-phaser-and-
> uses-it-for-lighting-purposes schtick?

Just watch, this is in some futuristic Girl Scouts manual somewhere.

- Berk Watkins
Student of Quantum Bogodynamics


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Terminus Est
Member since Nov-5-04
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Jun-01-09, 00:11 AM (EST)
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25. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #17
 
   Maybe not a Girl Scouts manual, but there's probably at least a dozen DIY articles telling how to jerry rig the things.
---
RCW # X-91873


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Gryphonadmin
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26. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #25
 
   >Maybe not a Girl Scouts manual, but there's probably at least a dozen
>DIY articles telling how to jerry rig the things.

It's on the Internet! The Internet: If it's out there, it's out there.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Matrix Dragon
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18. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   While rereading this, I had to wonder... what did the Minister get arrested for, besides irritating Asrial.

Matrix Dragon, J. Random Nutter


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Prince Charon
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May-31-09, 06:43 PM (EST)
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20. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #18
 
   I'm guessing 'being an utter idiot in public office'. That sort of stupidity can get people killed, you know.

“They planned their campaigns just as you might make a splendid piece of harness. It looks very well; and answers very well; until it gets broken; and then you are done for. Now I made my campaigns of ropes. If anything went wrong, I tied a knot; and went on.”
-- Arthur Wellesley, First Duke of Wellington


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dstar
Member since Oct-19-02
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May-31-09, 07:33 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #20
 
   >I'm guessing 'being an utter idiot in public office'. That sort of
>stupidity can get people killed, you know.
>

Oh, come _on_. No civilized society could function if you could be arrested for that -- the police would be too busy arresting most of the government. Every day.


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McFortner
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23. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #22
 
   >>I'm guessing 'being an utter idiot in public office'. That sort of
>>stupidity can get people killed, you know.
>>
>
>Oh, come _on_. No civilized society could function if you could be
>arrested for that -- the police would be too busy arresting most of
>the government. Every day.

Oh, we could only hope for a society like that. Sure would simplify things.

Michael



Michael C. Fortner
RCW #2n+1

"Rule 37 There is no such thing as "overkill".
There is only "open fire" and "I need to reload".



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BeardedFerret
Member since Apr-21-08
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May-31-09, 09:45 PM (EST)
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24. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #22
 
   "At any rate, I asked you here as a courtesy," the Minister went
on. "Your services will not be required in the upcoming operation. The
Vampire case is now entirely out of the Mounted Police's hands - so why
don't you go back to chasing pickpockets and leave the heavy lifting to
the security forces."
Grissom glanced sharply at him, but the Minister was on a roll
now and wouldn't be put off with a sharp glance. "Or whatever it is you
do," he added mock-graciously. "You may return to the Great Lodge.
Once we capture the Butcher, you may well be called upon to identify
him. What's left of him," he added with a nasty smile.

I'm going to go with criminal negligence, given that

a) Grissom was the one who was tracking the Butcher properly,
b) The minister personally kicked Grissom off the case,
c) The minister and his people were getting it wrong, and
d) The Butcher was after the Queen.


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Prince Charon
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19. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   One of the (many) best parts:

A moment later, Spock appeared from the buffet with a plate of
vegetarian dim sum in one hand and a thick sheaf of documents in the
other. The former he put in front of Saavik; the latter he handed to
Gryphon.
"My final act as your legal advocate," he explained to the
Earthman's questioning look. "These are the documents you must sign to
complete the bureaucratic processes surrounding your trial."
Gryphon flipped through the papers, skimming and signing them,
then paused at the last sheet and asked, "What's this one?"
Spock looked to see which one he meant, then replied in utter
deadpan, "That is an invoice to the GENOM Corporation, claiming the two
hundred fifty million Standard credits the company has promised to the
person who apprehends the Butcher of Musashi. It will be submitted the
moment HN1's trial is complete - which I am assured will be no later
than Monday."

Now, imagine Largo's face, when he gets the bill.

Manhunt, the whole thing, is awesome beyond my ability to describe.

“They planned their campaigns just as you might make a splendid piece of harness. It looks very well; and answers very well; until it gets broken; and then you are done for. Now I made my campaigns of ropes. If anything went wrong, I tied a knot; and went on.”
-- Arthur Wellesley, First Duke of Wellington


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CdrMike
Member since Feb-20-05
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Jun-01-09, 05:11 AM (EST)
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27. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   This really was an excellent adventure, from beginning to end. All that we knew and loved from Secrets is still there, just with a different coat of paint. Valeris' transformation, Spock's brilliant defense, Kei's jaw-dropping testimony, and Dr. Cochrane's..."expert opinion," were damn fine additions, but RepliGryphon's rant was really the cherry on top, having survived the refit to shine in all its glory.

Kudos to you, sir.

--------------------------
CdrMike, Overwatch Reject

"You know, the world could always use more heroes." - Tracer, Overwatch


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Sofaspud
Member since Apr-7-06
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Jun-01-09, 01:47 PM (EST)
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28. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
  
There isn't much I can say that others haven't already, so chalk up a bunch more fanboy gushing and we'll leave it at that.

However... I do want to say one thing.

Perhaps it's just me being a card-carrying Helpless Romantic, but, I was... let down, a bit, by the conclusion in regards to the Kei/Gryphon relationship.

Given that I really don't think the events of the Symphony are going to be negated by this, it's apparent that at some point they do "kiss and make up", for lack of a better phrase... but it still hurts a bit to see it this way.

It's better than it could have been, and better than the original Secrets, I'll grant. It's a lot more realistic. It's more human. It's more, and better, of everything.

But it's not the same, and I can't help but feel a little sad at losing that last little bit in the rewrite, even if I know intellectually that it'll all work out in the end.

--sofaspud
--


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Croaker
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29. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #28
 
   Yeah.

But we also see that they haven't really made up until the start of Core 4, so we need some room to come between them still. It's, what, a decade or so to go, at this point?

--
Croaker
RCW #mc2
"When in doubt, shoot something. Preferably the enemy."


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Gryphonadmin
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31. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #29
 
   LAST EDITED ON Jun-01-09 AT 02:29 PM (EDT)
 
>But we also see that they haven't really made up until the start of
>Core 4

Oh, well, they've made up here, inasmuch as they're no longer enemies but friends. They just haven't returned to the sack.

If I had it all to do over again, I'd probably leave them sort of post-apocalyptically platonic until the end of Twilight, when Kei has fully sorted out her shit and knows she wants the best parts of her old life back, but that would cause monumental disruption to the entire FI timeline by moving Kaitlyn's birth to around the time of the twins' and displacing them accordingly, so there's no way I'm going to even attempt it now.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-01-09, 02:23 PM (EST)
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30. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #28
 
   >Given that I really don't think the events of the Symphony are going
>to be negated by this, it's apparent that at some point they do "kiss
>and make up", for lack of a better phrase... but it still hurts a bit
>to see it this way.

Well, even in Secrets it's not as if they resumed their old relationship right there. In fact, if anything they're worse off there, because Kei is at such sixes and sevens that it's strongly implied he never sees or hears from her again until Crossroads - when she suddenly whistles and he comes running like a dog that's been lying on the porch waiting for the last eight years. I mean, what?

This time, I'm left with the impression that they'll be in touch, sort of the galactic-scale-civilization equivalent of amiable exes who live on opposite coasts. And with eight years of that kind of thing to feel their way back into what they used to mean to each other... I dunno, I think it's a lot more optimistic than it used to be. But maybe I've done a poor job of conveying it.

The same, in its way, goes for Zoner. Their parting here is a lot less awkward and seemingly-final than the one in Secrets. They're like old college roommates who now live in different states and work in different industries. (Like any number of actual relationships in my life, come to that.) It's much easier for me to believe that Zoner will eventually return to the WDF this way than it was when he just vanished back to his gun-for-hire life and apparently forgot how to use a telephone until tracked down and browbeaten into returning eight years later.

(And yeah, you can take from that the implication that the events of the first part of Crossroads may not have happened precisely as presented, but don't worry, I'm not likely to go and start rewriting the Core. If it bothers you, reconcile it by interpreting Crossroads as the Do You Remember Love? version. Maybe it's actually that movie about the return of the WDF Corwin and Utena watched in Interlude at the Hotel Monolith. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Terminus Est
Member since Nov-5-04
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Jun-01-09, 03:30 PM (EST)
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32. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #30
 
   In all honesty, I'd like to think of the entire core that way. I mean, it set the stage brilliantly, but the quality of writing and the understanding of the universe has come a long way since then. Thinking of them as a filmmaker's interpretation of the long road would seem to make sense, at least to the uninitiated (of which, I confess, I am still one; half of Eyrie's source material, I'd never even -heard of- before reading about it here. :)
---
RCW # X-91873


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Offsides
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Jun-06-09, 08:18 PM (EST)
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45. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #32
 
   I don't know if it was intentional at the time, but Core 4 includes what has to be one of the best "Deus Ex Machina" outs ever put into a series. The "creativity vortex" which the second versions of Gryph, Zoner and ReRob threw themselves into (and which semi led to the HL universe) has always felt prescient to me; if you look at most of the stuff that's needed changing, it's been from the time period before that event happened "onscreen", even if it was written after. Since that effectively "reset" the universe to the point of rewriting history, I tend to think of the redacted stuff as what may (or may not) have happened before that reset, and what we're getting now as the "new" history of the universe, even if it was a change from prior events.

That being said, I'm really enjoying the re-do of things, as I think it really makes the history much more interesting and gives a more fleshed-out feel to the exile (not to mention closing some of the bigger plot holes).

Well done!

Offsides

[...] in order to be a realist you must believe in miracles.
-- David Ben Gurion
EPU RCW #π
#include <stdsig.h>


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Star Ranger4
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34. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   And just to wrap this up:

> The android designated 33/S GRP-HN1, and known to much of the
>galaxy (at least for the last few minutes) as the Butcher of Musashi,

Point of order, counsul... He's always been known as the Butcher, its
just most of the galaxy DIDNT know he was a Replicant who did it
specifically to frame UF-G!

> "Uh, point of order, Lieutenant Commander Hunter?" said
>navigator Rick Sterling while checking with Salusia's GPS network to
>make sure they were heading for the right bridge.
> "Proceed, Lieutenant Commander Sterling," Hunter replied mock-
>formally.

BWAHAHAHAH, you know it has to be some sort of heavy shit for Rick and
Max to get even semi serious like this...

> For a second, both HN1, as he sprinted toward the bridge, and
>the crew of the Surprise themselves wondered whether they had just made
>a terrible mistake, for when the doctored torpedo emerged from the tube,
>it looked just like they always did. Putting on the brakes, HN1 saw the
>torpedo in its orange corona of light, so distinct as the stress of the
>moment dilated time that he imagined he could see the markings on its
>casing, just as it struck the side of the bridge's main arch.

And again, without having to say it You can all but feel Rick and Max
whispering (Alan) SHeppard's Prayer...

Apprapos of nothing, I also assume that by the lack of any byplay about
"You've only got one shot" / "I only NEED one shot" that they did, in fact
aquire at least ONE more Photorp?

>The toll would have been higher, the authorities believed, if it
>weren't winter, when the city's young would be less likely to be inside
>after dark anyway, just because of the cold and the snow.

I think something slipped past the Usual suspects... or that no one noticed
till you posted 6 up early. But shouldnt winter make it less likely to be
OUTSIDE after dark, not inside?

> There was nothing wrong with Sara's mind; it was her heart that
>was broken. Unwilling to accept that her mother should go to prison for
>what was, to Sara, no crime - and yet inevitably affected by her
>father's death - she found herself unable to form any kind of attachment
>to the rotating series of usually-well-meaning strangers into whose far-
>flung homes she was thrust.

Yeah, seeing your mother imprisoned for having to put your father down like
some sort of rabid animal WOULD tend to do that to a kid.
I suppose some might question recasting young Sara into the roll of the
'rescued orphan' from the original, but to me this all just feels so.. well..
right.

> As for the killer, well, Sara wasn't afraid of him either. An
>officer off some Federation ship had misplaced his Type 1 phaser in the
>market square the previous summer, and by good fortune and industry it
>had come into Sara's hands.

Good fortune and industry indeed, since she'd also have had to beat more
criminally intent types to the punch to get it.

>If you had a phaser,
>some wire, and a little tape, you didn't need a CE dry battery to make a
>lantern work. Such a miniscule drain was no great hardship to the
>sarium krellide cell in even the smallest phaser.

Heh. Then again, most folk dont HAVE access to Phasers of any sort, Sara.
Probobly why they discared that lamp in the first place.

>She recoiled, more surprised than afraid, and
>dropped the book as the intruder - a young Cheltari man, maybe in his
>early forties - gave her a cheerful leer and forced his way inside a bit
>further.
> "Good evening," he said in a bizarrely normal tone of voice,
>given what he was doing. "We're going to have a nice time together, you
>and I."

Man. right up till this sentance I'd been making like that river in egypt
myself and not seeing your hints that there was more than one 'baddie' on
the loose, instead insisting to myself that the Butcher HAD to be behind
ALL of it.

> Off in the distance there was a deep, reverberating BOOM,
>followed by the sound of rending metal and falling concrete, as if a
>building had been blown up

More like a bridge, but the two particpants of this little dance dont
know that, do they...

>She found this so
>terrifyingly transfixing that she forgot all about repairing her weapon;
>she just lay there, eyes huge and white-rimmed in the gloom, and watched
>the Saenar Ripper die.

Glad to see that she FINALLY shakes off this tendency towards paralyitc
terror by the time she confronted Hayg'n

>The discharge struck the Butcher in the left
>eye and blew the synthetic flesh off the entire upper left quarter of
>his face.

Nice touch, tying this back into the fact the Butcher's face is all scared
come Crossroads.

>He was a policeman, a kindly-faced
>Cheltari in the brass-buttoned green jacket, polished crossbelt, and
>brown campaign hat of a Royal Salusian Mountie.

Eh? Why is Gil in full uniform? from being 'called on the carpet' by
that ASS of a minister still? Or does the SID normally work in uniform?

> "I shall do so, Inspector," the man - tall, thin, with the most
>wonderfully deep voice - replied, and Grissom turned and hurried back
>into the alley.

This had to have been one of those total AHA moments you and the crew talk
about G, where everything falls into place; This makes so much of the REST
of Sara's UF history make sense, from why criminalistics (assuming that she
wasnt already interested in them and this just cements it) to why she even
applys to the VSA after her undergrad degree.

> "Are you a -Vulcan?-" she asked, awestruck.
> The officer looked down at her. "I am," he replied. "My name
>is Spock." He put a hand on her shoulder and asked with a sort of
>infinitely calm kindness, "What is yours?"
> She blinked. "I'm Sara," she said.

This reminds me. What happens to Sara after this? As much as I want to
believe that she is placed into either Spock or Gil's care, I dont think
she was, or some of the other comments (like Hayg'n mockingly calling her
Grissom's diciple) just dont make sense...

> Duke grinned, his teeth glinting in the glow of the streetlights
>below. "Because this is where he had to be. The answers he needs are
>here."

Well, mostly the PHYSICAL evidence he needs to help prove it, till
Largo's meglomania giftwrapped the whole package for him.

> "We can still end this peacefully," he said. "There's no need
>for us to descend to bloodshed."
> "What do you think we've all been doing SO far tonight, Officer?
>Playing fucking racquetball?" the Butcher sneered.

Well, no. But YOU are the one who's been more into the overall mayhem.
From what I can see the various crewmembers of the Surprise, Enterprise,
and even the RSMP and Mars Division have been using restraint so far.
Besides, Gil's training is such he really really does have to give you
one more chance even if you DONT deserve it. Just a shame we dont get
actual confirmation that it really is a lightsaber in there, though I
personally have no doubt. Guns dont fit well in cylinders.

> The Butcher's face went red, his mood suddenly switching from
>mocking exultation to rage. "Bring it, furface," he snarled. "I'll
>take your popgun away from you and FUCK you with it - wha?!"

But its NOT a popgun. While I could have wished for Gris to get to go
all Jedi on the Butcher, Valeris' redemption works much better here.
Just one more piece of proof of how you've moved beyond damn good to
totally f'n brilliant.

>I was Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Rambo and Kerry Eurodyne
>rolled into one.

Kerry Eurodyne? Did I miss something or is this just a one shot riff
of someone who's famous only in the UF verse?

>it was a deeply aggrieved man sunk far down in a fugue
>of fury, administering a good old-fashioned trade union beatdown -
>pounding his foe into a broken, blood-soaked heap and singing "I've Been
>Working on the Railroad" under his breath as he swung the redneck katana
>over and over.

Well, if he'd sung it out loud the world would think he'd gone as
far round the bend as the Butcher already is!

> Grissom didn't let go. "I think Her Majesty would be just as
>happy if her Knight-Commander -didn't- turn out to be a murderer after
>all."
> Gryphon stared at him, furious - how could the man call THIS
>murder?!

Because Gil isnt in the fuegerage state UF you is in and can see that
if you dont stop now, you'll undo everything you've fought to regain
this night.

> "You may keep your sword, Captain," he replied, then added
>wryly, "I won't have it said that James T. Kirk treated a fellow
>starship captain like a common criminal. I'll have to hold you on board
>Enterprise until we can make arrangements for trial, but if you'll give
>me your parole, as one officer to another, you won't be confined to
>quarters."

Not to mention downright churlish to not treat him with respect until
or unless UF-G showed himself to be unworthy of it. Fortunatly for us
UF G isnt.

> Pulling out the device, he flipped it open and said, "Hello?"
>Stiffening to something like attention, he said in a much more civil
>tone, "Y-yes, Your Majesty! Well, I... no... yes... yes... very good,
>Your Majesty." Moving the phone away from his head, the Minister
>covered the mouthpiece with one hand and said to the taller of the two
>CCC officers, "Sergeant? Her Majesty the Queen wishes to speak with
>you."

Gotta love her Majesty's timing here. I gotta wonder aloud, though
was it cause she was watching Network 23? Naa, cant be. We saw
Edison sign off a few paragraphs back, just before he had to ask Theora
how the heck to get down from that roof.

Delta IV Survival Medal? Given that its 'apochryphal', one wonders
if the situation surrounding it ever becomes important enough to relate
to us. Sadly, I doubt it ever will.

> One row back from the defendant's table, Jamie Finney leaned
>over and elbowed Vanessa Leeds. "(Jesus, it's Nogura!)" she whispered.
>"(Didn't he ever have hair?)"

Apparently not. It'll work well when 'Fleet makes the move to the bootie
jammies though. Maybe he's a victem of early male pattern baldness, or
an early proponent of the "Bald is sexay" Movement, though they dont really
hit their stride till Picard comes on the scene.

>He seemed to know it was weak, but rather than capitulate to that fact
>and just cruise through, he dug in and pursued what few solid facts he
>had with the vigor of a religious zealot.

Ah, basicly showing the same traits that will make him such a good, if not
especially charismatic Admiral in a few years...

> Spock arched an eyebrow. "Indeed? I will not pretend to
>understand your thought process, but I will do my best."

Well, I'd say his thought processes are pretty much betting on the same sort of
tenacity that discovered the tampering at Kirk's courtmartial, as well as
his banking on your being all but identical to your SI counterpart.

> "YOU WILL NEVER TAKE HIM ALIVE, FILTHY EARTHMEN!"
>
> "Valeris. -Valeris!-" Duke muttered, swatting at her with his
>notebook. "Wake up, dammit, wake up!"

I think what makes Valeris so interesting, aside from her gettting a fair share
of great zingers, is your exploration of the paradigm shift Valeris is experiancing
in first having her control shattered by her meld with Hunter and his subsequent
'treatment', and her examination of if, maybe, the path of Surak was not the right
choice for her after all?

>"I can only tell you that I
>was there at the personal request of my monarch."
> "And what jurisdiction did she have over the matter?" Nogura
>asked archly.
> "That was not mine to consider, sir," Grissom replied. "I am a
>servant of the Crown. Nothing more."

Eat that, Hairy! My personal take is that he was hoping to use this line
of questioning to call Queen Azrael's impartiality into question, only to
have Gil's response blow up in his face.

>"Therefore, the records
>and testimony of those who served with him must go a long way toward
>establishing the man's character - and that will be a critical factor in
>the absence of concrete scientific conclusions."

Indeed. If you cant scientificaly prove he did or did not, it all comes
down to if you believe he's the sort of person who'd do such a thing.

>"The log buoy recovered from the wreck of
>the USS Invincible bears such a record as well.

In addition I'd bet Grissom could run that little wassis test on it and
show that, since it has a resonance of 723.21 instead of 100 summat, its
clearly not from THESE parts. Not that "Hairy" Nogura would be real thrilled
to have to try and cross examine Griss again. Anyone want to take bets
on if he'd even bother?

>"Very well, Mr.
>Spock. You will be required to present your authentication of the buoy
>and your determination of its extradimensional origin in due course."

Ah. He will be having Gil get up and say just that when it becomes important,
but yeah, after the drubbing Gil gave Hairy the first time, his second appearance
probobly would be dull.

> Here was Henry Lang, explaining how, even though he had served
>as a chief engineer aboard one of the fleet's most advanced starships
>himself, and had co-authored the famous Enterprise refit of 2271 with
>the great Montgomery Scott, he had never once interfered with Lang's
>responsibilities as Invincible's chief.

Though not an engineer myself, I've heard enough horror stories to know
that the temptaion is both common and hard to resist amoung engineers who
move up to the center chair.

>here was Vanessa Leeds saying that Invincible was her
>very first deep space posting out of the academy, and that her academy
>classmates Kim and Samantha

There's the rest of the trio! Shame, that... though its nice to know that
they are probobly ok back in the SI universe rather than amoung Invincibles
casualties. And as far as the 'others', like Claudia Hayes or Lisa Grant...
I bet they were fellow cadets to either Vanessa or Rick and Max... (though
most likely as Senior cadets. Cant you just now visualise a Lisa Grant as
cadet commander being thouroughly frustrated with the lax discipline of Rick
or Max, or BOTH, in their plebe year?)
Sorry about examining this waaaaay to closely. But it says something about
how enjoyable we all find it that we sit and think about these things...

> Saavik looked straight through Nogura, her eyes coldly
>dismissive, and said, "I was that child, Commodore."

Hairy, Hairy, Hairy. Didnt anyone ever explain the first rule of Litigation
to you? Dont ask a question unless you know what the answer is, and that its
going to be in your favor?

>the tanned redhead, dressed in a neatly pressed silver-and-black
>Worlds Welfare Work Association dress uniform, took the stand and was
>sworn.

Well, its nice to see that this time around it didnt take Kei getting
married for the 3WA to decide it FINALLY needed Dress uniforms.

> "During your long association with him, did you ever have any
>reason to believe that he might be developing... mental instability?"
> Without a heartbeat's hesitation, Kei replied, "No."
> Nogura blinked. "I beg your pardon, Consultant?"

Doggonnit Hairy, didnt you learn NOTHING from the Drubbings you've gotten
from testimony already? If you dont know for sure the answer is going to
help your side, DONT ASK THAT QUESTION!

> Kei shrugged dismissively. "Cut. Paste. So easy even a
>Starfleet shyster can do it."

In Hairys defense here, I dont think he's actually part of the JAG corps.
Or if he is, you should have done a better job of establishing that earlier.

> Nogura eyed her narrowly. "Have you been drinking, Consultant?"

Oh Hairy. You are SO about to step in it with that one...

>"Because I'd like to get my first good night's sleep in 92 years
>tonight, Mr. Spock. That's all."

Ouch. I bet watching the news coverage of the battle of Queen Shiva park
and Repli Gryph's comments had to really sting, even if she'd intitialy
believed she'd finaly come to terms with it all after having grown so close
to Hellboy.

> Leonard McCoy
>looked like someone had just handed him a gold brick, or possibly hit
>him with it.

Or both!

> "Do I really... -pause- like that?" Kirk wondered when McCoy had
>control of himself again.
> "You do, Captain. And to very good effect. It is a rhetorical
>technique I also endeavored to adopt in this proceeding."

Oh gods.... so many GREAT lines in this story. I'd expect that next time
someone happens to bring up a Fav line's topic it gets flooded with stuf from
Manhunt... at least till someone says "Manhunt. The whole thing."

> Stone looked as if he might make some further comment, but
>Fitzpatrick only nodded.

Even though the court has already reached its verdict, this action truely
says as much, if not more, about their opinons on the matter than even their
actual testimony.

> When Fitzpatrick finally did have the room quieted, he went on,
>"This verdict nullifies the remaining charges.

On the grounds that if Gryph wasnt falsly accused of the primaries, he'd not
have had to engage in the others, right? Though who charged him with rape?
just something Genom came up with to help vilify him?

> Kirk's hazel eyes twinkled. "I hate to disappoint you, Captain,
>but she's already got plans the next time Enterprise is in the system."
> Gryphon gave a delighted laugh. "Oh, well bowled, Captain Kirk,
>well bowled. A cup of tea with you, sir."

Even more interesting when you remember that by the time of SOS Kirk has a
half Salusian son in the IPO, or was it aboard Picard's Enterprise?

> "Nah," Zoner replied. "I'm... that's not my life any more. But
>hey. Congratulations, man. Take care of yourself. I'll... I'll see
>you around."

IOW, Zoner's still angsting. Only not about what the hell happened to them
but more along the lines of "How could I have let myself be so STUPID about it"
IIRC, he's still got about 8 years of getting that out of his system to go, right?

>"That is an invoice to the GENOM Corporation, claiming the two
>hundred fifty million Standard credits the company has promised to the
>person who apprehends the Butcher of Musashi. It will be submitted the
>moment HN1's trial is complete - which I am assured will be no later
>than Monday."

And given Largo's nasty habit of killing the messenger (not to mention
the golden geese) I shure pity the poor schlub who has to tell him about
THAT.

>"-That- was surreal," he commented.

Nope, that was vintage "Reality", straight out of the core stories that
launched a thousand RCW's. Didn't you let us in on just what was the
joke with the binder somewhere on the forums? If so, a clue so I can go
searching the archives? Something about it being his GM notes for a
campaing that had a lot of similarites to the events of Core 1?

>"And while... what I have
>become... is not quite the form I would have expected my symbolic
>rebirth to take..." She looked up suddenly, her face breaking into a
>great beaming smile. "It's -fucking- -awesome.-"

But being free, even of ones cultural baggage, is not always an easy road.
Go in peace, Valeris, and may Odin grant you the strength you'll need.

>"I'll tell you what. Stay with Duke. Learn to see the cosmic
>truth. And when you're ready, come and see me. I'll have a job for
>you... and I'll forgive you."

Classic UF You. No one succeeds at turnning enemies into allies quite like
UF you. Do we know what becomes of her eventually and I'm just forgetting,
or is that a story yet to be told?

> Gryphon laughed and mounted the transporter platform. Saavik
>took the pad to his right, Jamie to his left, and Vanessa the one to the
>left of that.
> "You're quite right, Mr. Saavik," he said. ""Let's go check out
>our shipyards. Energize!"

HUH? OH... I am suffering from a not investigating this closely ENOUGH,
after all that investigating stuff TOO closely. They're beaming from HQ
to the Enterprise, Right? Not from the Enterprise to somewhere else like
I initially and incorrectly assumed?

> Several Enterprise security officers

None of said red shirts, in a first for them, actually biting it on camera...
not to say there wernt casualties... but they didnt happen on screen.

Now, I'm off to read G's annotations. You know, now that I know those are up I bet I'll find at least SOME of the answers to the points I've twigged to...


Of COURSE you wernt expecting it!
No One expects the FANNISH INQUISITION!
RCW# 86


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Gryphonadmin
Charter Member
19261 posts
Jun-02-09, 01:12 AM (EST)
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35. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #34
 
   >> "Uh, point of order, Lieutenant Commander Hunter?" said
>>navigator Rick Sterling while checking with Salusia's GPS network to
>>make sure they were heading for the right bridge.
>> "Proceed, Lieutenant Commander Sterling," Hunter replied mock-
>>formally.
>
>BWAHAHAHAH, you know it has to be some sort of heavy shit for Rick and
>Max to get even semi serious like this...

It's a running joke with Max and Rick that they've always been promoted almost in lockstep. During the short period when one was a lieutenant commander and the other still a mere lieutenant, they started very formally addressing each other by their full ranks in this way to sort of mock each other, and just kept on once the other caught up. :)

>But shouldnt winter make it less likely
>to be
>OUTSIDE after dark, not inside?

Indeed it should.

>Eh? Why is Gil in full uniform? from being 'called on the carpet' by
>that ASS of a minister still? Or does the SID normally work in
>uniform?

The latter. Unlike their real-world Canadian counterparts, who only wear the red serge for special occasions these days, Salusian Mounties almost always wear the green - except for detectives, which, officially, SID officers are not.

>This had to have been one of those total AHA moments you and the crew
>talk
>about G, where everything falls into place

Yeah, it totally was, especially when I pulled out the calculator and confirmed that Sara would've been the right age in 2380.

>This reminds me. What happens to Sara after this?

She went back into the system, but with certain important personages taking a personal (but discreet) interest in the case, she was handled much more carefully and found her way into a situation where she could be at least reasonably comfortable; and with a pen pal in Starfleet who could always be counted upon to provide intellectual stimulation and - odd as it seems - spiritual guidance, she was content until the time came when she could get out on her own.

>>I was Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, Rambo and Kerry Eurodyne
>>rolled into one.
>
>Kerry Eurodyne? Did I miss something or is this just a one shot riff
>of someone who's famous only in the UF verse?

I think he's a pop star in the Cyberpunk 2020 game setting; how he found his way into a 24th-century UF pop culture reference I'm not sure. The Butcher's dialogue here is salvaged straight from Secrets, and I was playing in a CP2020 game at around the time that I started work on that, so...

>>"This verdict nullifies the remaining charges.
>
>On the grounds that if Gryph wasnt falsly accused of the primaries,
>he'd not
>have had to engage in the others, right?

Pretty much, yeah. It's also a variation on the fruit-of-the-poison-tree principle; if he didn't do the initial crime, chances are he didn't do somet of the subsequent ones people thought he had either, such as:

>Though who charged him with
>rape?
>just something Genom came up with to help vilify him?

Could easily have been something HN1 did. That list of crimes is probably a mixture of criminal stuff G actually did in the course of being a fugitive (impersonating an officer comes to mind) and actual straight-up crimes HN1 committed in the course of being a kill-crazed rogue robot.

>Nope, that was vintage "Reality", straight out of the core stories
>that
>launched a thousand RCW's. Didn't you let us in on just what was the
>joke with the binder somewhere on the forums?

Don't know offhand. Let me know if you find it; I don't recall myself what the deal was with Vaughn's binder (other than I think the injoke started because the real Vaughn had one that he misplaced).

>Do we know what becomes of her eventually and I'm just
>forgetting,
>or is that a story yet to be told?

The latter; I think Manhunt is the first time Valeris ever appears in UF.

>They're beaming from HQ
>to the Enterprise, Right?

Correct!

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Barricade
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Jun-05-09, 01:10 AM (EST)
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37. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   *scratches head*
So umm...how will this then affect Kei getting together with Gryphon then? IIRC, as its been (gee...umm....*goes back to read*...bugger) ages since I read the 'colonization' of the Dyson Sphere/Sterling Saga, and the wedding, wasn't Kei single at that time?

Other then that, this is great. And Saavik's shoot-down of Nogura? I would have openly wept tears of sheer vindication (and vindictiveness) at how she ended that.

I do hope though that the new USS Invincible that Astrial ordered up for him contains a keel forged from the remains of the original. Otherwise it just doesn't feel right.


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Rickdominated
Member since Jul-29-15
8 posts
Jun-05-09, 04:53 AM (EST)
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38. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #37
 
   From what the GPDB on the Invincible says, its hull components went into the Concordia as did its bridge, which after a refit ended up on Challenger


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Gryphonadmin
Charter Member
19261 posts
Jun-05-09, 08:54 AM (EST)
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40. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #38
 
   >From what the GPDB on the Invincible says, its hull components
>went into the Concordia as did its bridge, which after a refit
>ended up on Challenger

The part about the bridge is true. The part about the rest of the wreck probably isn't.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Gryphonadmin
Charter Member
19261 posts
Jun-05-09, 08:53 AM (EST)
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39. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #37
 
   >So umm...how will this then affect Kei getting together with Gryphon
>then?

Unknown, but I'm not inclined to worry about it too much.

>I do hope though that the new USS Invincible that Astrial ordered up
>for him contains a keel forged from the remains of the original.

None such, as presented in Infamy; that ship, an Andromeda-class battleship, was newly completed for fleet service and was presented to the IPSF unexpectedly, on quite short notice, after Challenger was crippled in the Battle of Bajor. Until that ceremony she'd probably had some other name, and had nothing at all to do with the old Invy.

But don't worry; when Infamy reappears, the Salusian vessel that serves as the IPSF's temporary flagship in Challenger's absence will still have her original RSN name (let's say, just for the sake of filling the place, that she was HMS Indomitable). The "new" Invincible will be quite something else again...

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Star Ranger4
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Jun-05-09, 12:11 PM (EST)
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41. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #39
 
   >>So umm...how will this then affect Kei getting together with Gryphon
>>then?
>
>Unknown, but I'm not inclined to worry about it too much.
>
Especially when you consider that he's working from a false premise here...
Kei and UF-G dont get together for another 8 years (start of crossroads)
and don't finally get married until after the battle of the Sphere.


>But don't worry; when Infamy reappears, the Salusian vessel
>that serves as the IPSF's temporary flagship in Challenger's
>absence will still have her original RSN name (let's say, just for the
>sake of filling the place, that she was HMS Indomitable). The
>"new" Invincible will be quite something else again...

*thumbs up* Can't wait to see it when you finally get around to it.


Of COURSE you wernt expecting it!
No One expects the FANNISH INQUISITION!
RCW# 86


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Prince Charon
Member since Jan-11-09
309 posts
Jun-05-09, 01:43 PM (EST)
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42. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #41
 
   I wonder if the wedding will have all the same jokes, now that, for example, Leader Desslok is part of UF canon.

“They planned their campaigns just as you might make a splendid piece of harness. It looks very well; and answers very well; until it gets broken; and then you are done for. Now I made my campaigns of ropes. If anything went wrong, I tied a knot; and went on.”
-- Arthur Wellesley, First Duke of Wellington


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Peter Eng
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1452 posts
Jun-05-09, 01:54 PM (EST)
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43. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #42
 
   >I wonder if the wedding will have all the same jokes, now that, for
>example, Leader Desslok is part of UF canon.
>

Even if it does, there's room to fiddle with it. Perhaps the current Desslok is named for an ancestor, from a time when the polite thing to do was shout the leader's name as he or she came in.

How would the WDF know about this protocol? There are so many options. (At this point, "went to war, beat them, handed them a copy of Derek's book" is almost overused.)

Peter Eng
--
I'm only a Charter Member because of the DCForum upgrade, and because there's no rank below "Clueless F!wit."


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jadmire
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Jun-05-09, 11:42 PM (EST)
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44. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #39
 
   Let her, by all means, be IPS Indomitable; I can think of no better name for the Space Force's flagship after the ordeal of Bajor.

-Joe=


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inklesspen
Member since Jun-8-09
2 posts
Jun-08-09, 06:24 AM (EST)
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46. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   Something's bugging me, regarding Dr. Cochrane's testimony. It's all well and good that he's inspected the boomer, but he goes on to state that Gryphon should be found innocent because he helped invent warp drive, which seems less well-grounded. Does the good doctor imagine that no mass-murderer is also capable of invention?


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BZArchermoderator
Member since Nov-9-05
1668 posts
Jun-08-09, 07:46 AM (EST)
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48. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #46
 
   I think it's more "Y'know, I worked with this guy for a very long time on something really complex and time-consuming, and I think I'd notice if he was capable of being a mass murderer" than bad people can't invent things.

---------------------------
Matt "BZArcher" Wagner
@BZArcher / bzarcher at gmail
"Here's an itemized list of 30
years of disagreements!"


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Wedge
Charter Member
Jun-08-09, 04:45 PM (EST)
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49. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #48
 
   >I think it's more "Y'know, I worked with this guy for a very long time
>on something really complex and time-consuming, and I think I'd notice
>if he was capable of being a mass murderer" than bad people can't
>invent things.

It's also worth noting that he wasn't an official called witness. He's just loud. :)


Chad Collier
Smirking Kilrathi
The Captain of the Gravy Train


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Silent Soul
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Jun-08-09, 07:44 AM (EST)
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47. "RE: Manhunt 6"
In response to message #0
 
   I've been saving Manhunt for a sort of weekend indulgence, waiting for the whole thing to be available. I was, to say the least, not disappointed.

I'll sum up. Secrets was good fun.

Manhunt is freakin' brilliant.

I've seen a number of instances where Gryphon has hinted that he's a bit dissatisfied with some of his earlier work, and I've certainly been there myself. When the folks at Eyrie meddle with their previous work, however, they seem to do it with style and a deft hand, and, more importantly, for the right reasons. This is a prime example.

I keep waiting for George Lucas to have that particular epiphany.

No joy yet.




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