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Subject: "Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Matrix Dragon
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Nov-21-01, 00:15 AM (EDT)
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"Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
 
   Now that I've finally finished reading the Movement, I think I can make a few observations.

Liza Broadbank - I'm impressed Gryph. By the end of Hunted Rose, I really didn't care what happened to her, as long as it was painful. Now though, I can't help but feel sorry for her. She's spent her entire life trying to please her father, an arrogant asshole that couldn't care less for her, only to be abandoned by him when she needs him the most. She's been denying the existance of her telepathic abilities, which seems like trying to deny your sense of sight or hearing. I hope she finds what she's looking for on the t'skrang ship. I may come to like the new Liza, something I never thought possible before last night.

Azalynn - Watching Az in this movement was quite... disturbing. There was almost no sign of the care-free Dantrovian I'm used to. Instead, much of her time was spent being angry at Liza. Understandable, considering what Liza did, but Az holding a grudge is extremely bizarre. Like Liza, she needs to regain her balance, something that I'm looking forward to seeing.

The end of WPI - I was half expecting this. After all, there wasn't much left after Psi Corp was done with it. But I like the proposed new school. It's in a good location and has a good name (I've never forgiven you guys for killing Deedlit) It gives the Duelists a new home, away from the Earth Alliance. However, I'm sorry to see Devlin and Amanda leaving the school. While I know it won't be the last we see of them, they might not be around as much.

Amanda and Rina - I've actually had this thought in my head for a while now. Rina's purpose in life is to protect Amanda, no matter what the cost. And yet she's hardly ever actually been there to carry out her duty. The effect it had on her was pretty bad. On a happier note, I want their hunt for Xenia written up in some form or another. Some people don't deserve to be alive, and the youngest Dessler is one of them. (And whoever made the Rina/Ranma-chan comparison is a bastard!)

Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet. With every passing day, the Earth Alliance is turning that force into pure military, rather then the military/exploration that it once was. While I understand his beliefs that by working from within Starfleet, maybe he can restore the Federation to what it once was, I have to side with UF-Gryphons opinion in its chances. Still, this UF version of TNG Enterprise is quite well done, even if they should be in the IPO of WDF.

Aya - Dear God, nothing's changed with her. But most important was her observations on how Corwin delayed a war with about three seconds to spare. It gave a glimpse of a few other problems in the galaxy. One question: What's Corellia's problem with Salusia?

Kate's trial - It started off exciting, but by the time it got to about Len, I was wondering what the hell you were doing. To me, it looked like some form of torture, not a test. Then, when she pushed herself beyond her limits against Hammer, it started to make sense to me. I've got this image of her and Hammer going at it, both vanishing and reappearing in short bursts, which goes down as one of the best duels in the series so far.

Stick - STICK???

Saionji - Sorry, but his method of forcing Liza to use her powers was careless, crazy, and.... actually, pretty much Saionji. Freaky, and as dangerous as all hell, but it got Liza out of her suicidal mood. I didn't like it at first, but it makes a little more sense with time.

Overall, I liked it. Well done, and I'm looking forward to the second Symphony.

One last question, actually taken from Hunted Rose: Where the hell does the Earth Alliance, a nation about fifteen years old, get off by refering to the Freespacers, a nation that's been around for four centuries, as a group of pirates and not a real country?

Matrix Dragon
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." --J.R.R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for obvious reasons." -Matrix Dragon

Matrix Dragon, J. Random Nutter


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Redneck Nov-21-01 1
  RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Luc Nov-21-01 2
  RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Gryphonadmin Nov-21-01 3
     RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Redneck Nov-21-01 4
         RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Shadowhavoc Nov-21-01 7
             RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Redneck Nov-21-01 8
                 RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Shadowhavoc Nov-21-01 9
                     RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Gryphonadmin Nov-21-01 12
     RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts BobSchroeck Nov-21-01 6
         RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Ebony Nov-21-01 11
             RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Neophyte Nov-25-01 13
  RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts Wedge Nov-21-01 5
  Deedlit's Death remandeteam Nov-21-01 10
     RE: Deedlit's Death Matrix Dragon Nov-25-01 14

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Redneck
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Nov-21-01, 01:15 AM (EDT)
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1. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #0
 
   >Now that I've finally finished reading the Movement, I think I can
>make a few observations.

>Aya - Dear God, nothing's changed with her. But most important was her
>observations on how Corwin delayed a war with about three seconds to
>spare. It gave a glimpse of a few other problems in the galaxy. One
>question: What's Corellia's problem with Salusia?

Corellia has become almost indistinguishable, culturally and politically, from most of the Earth-settled worlds, and especially Earth itself. This is pretty much because of the corporate rule of the Corellian worlds, which has homogenized the native culture to the vanishing point. Before Earth's First Contact, Corellia was Salusia's closest ally. Today, Salusia is in near-constant opposition to Earth, and Corellia is looking more and more likely to make its unofficial alliance with Earth official...

>One last question, actually taken from Hunted Rose: Where the hell
>does the Earth Alliance, a nation about fifteen years old, get off by
>refering to the Freespacers, a nation that's been around for four
>centuries, as a group of pirates and not a real country?

The Earth Alliance has inherited the role of world-government from the Aegis government of Olympus. A few of Earthdome's officials were in both governments, or in other political entities existing back in 2368 when the CFMF was hired by a certain revolutionary group to support their operations. The Freespacer intervention in 'internal Earth affairs' has never been forgotten or forgiven.

The Earth Alliance in general- and the Psi Corps especially- have begun a major whispering campaign to throw the legitimacy of the Freespacers as a nation into doubt. After all, they only exist as a legal fiction for this great huge bully of a mercenary fleet, right? They defy legitimate law and order everywhere, you know, with that amnesty they offer just anyone. And when their fleet moves into your system, the economy goes completely haywire- that's not right! Why, they don't even have a planet, for goodness' sake!

The results thus far have been mixed, but they're very noteworthy on Earth settlements which have remained stable and peaceful for long periods of time... and certain other worlds, such as Vulcan and its colonies, which are either pacifistic in philosophy or who do not like the presence of nonconformists.

Redneck (that's probably why we got passed over for the MLB expansion AGAIN)

Red wizard needs money badly...
www.wlpcomics.com
White Lightning Productions - don't tell the Pope


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Luc
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Nov-21-01, 01:59 AM (EDT)
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2. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #0
 
   >One last question, actually taken from Hunted Rose: Where the hell
>does the Earth Alliance, a nation about fifteen years old, get off by
>refering to the Freespacers, a nation that's been around for four
>centuries, as a group of pirates and not a real country?

Answer from an unknowing observer:

The Earth Alliance is almost certainly very concerned with Legitimacy (in part because of their Lack Thereof), and thus probably have a very precise Delineation of Legitimate Nations, with Themselves at the Top, and loose alliances such as the freespacers regarded as Nonexistent.

In addition, the Earth Alliance needs to have control over as much of it's own populace as possible for its plans to go forward; one of the chief threats to that is a nation of refugees with a long tradition of granting asylum.

In order to advance this goal, and, as a side effect, advance the goal of potential domination, one can try to discredit ones enemies if one is to weaken them without fighting.

<speculation mode = rampant>
While Lord Surtur has other allies, the Earth Alliance has been a most productive group of helpers indeed.
</speculation>

Thanks
Luc "Random Thought" French


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Gryphonadmin
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22374 posts
Nov-21-01, 02:01 AM (EDT)
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3. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #0
 
   >I may come to like the new Liza, something I never thought possible
>before last night.

I hope so - I already do, though admittedly I have a better seat than you do. :)

>(I've never
>forgiven you guys for killing Deedlit)

(points at ReRob)

All his idea, man. I just implemented it. (Though I was pleased with the way it came out. It was the first time I'd killed a named character since Fritz Koopman, and Fritz died because his real-world analog asked to be killed off.)

>Amanda and Rina - I've actually had this thought in my head for a
>while now. Rina's purpose in life is to protect Amanda, no matter what
>the cost. And yet she's hardly ever actually been there to carry out
>her duty. The effect it had on her was pretty bad.

Well, I dunno about "hardly ever" - Amanda's only been going to WPI the last two years - but it has been very hard on her, and all the harder because Amanda didn't seem to notice. Rina put a brave face on it, but to her, because of her upbringing and training, it felt like a rejection.

Things will be very different now, which is, like most major life changes, both good and bad.

>(And whoever made the Rina/Ranma-chan comparison is a bastard!)

Actually, having hunted up an image or two, it's - speaking strictly visually - not a bad comparison. Rina doesn't wear her hair like that, but she could if she grew it out.

>Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet.

He's stuck only by his own choice; if the day came that he wanted out, Gryphon and Grand Admiral Takaya would have a bidding war for his services. :)

>Kate's trial - It started off exciting, but by the time it got to
>about Len, I was wondering what the hell you were doing. To me, it
>looked like some form of torture, not a test. Then, when she pushed
>herself beyond her limits against Hammer, it started to make sense to
>me.

Ah, good. Mission accomplished! I was worried that the make-sense aspect wouldn't survive the translation from my mental studio (which was feeding me very John Woo imagery at that point) to the virtual page...

>Stick - STICK???

Yes, dammit, for the last time, Stick. That's what it is, that's what it's called. But it's not a stick, mind you that - it's the Stick. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/

-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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Redneck
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Nov-21-01, 02:05 AM (EDT)
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4. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #3
 
  

>>Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet.
>
>He's stuck only by his own choice; if the day came that he wanted out,
>Gryphon and Grand Admiral Takaya would have a bidding war for his
>services. :)

They would not be alone in that bidding war, either. }:-{D

Redneck

Red wizard needs money badly...
www.wlpcomics.com
White Lightning Productions - don't tell the Pope


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Shadowhavoc
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Nov-21-01, 09:27 AM (EDT)
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7. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #4
 
   >
>
>>>Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet.
>>
>>He's stuck only by his own choice; if the day came that he wanted out,
>>Gryphon and Grand Admiral Takaya would have a bidding war for his
>>services. :)
>
>They would not be alone in that bidding war, either. }:-{D

Now that is something I'd like to see.

Let me flip a three sided coin....


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Redneck
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Nov-21-01, 01:01 PM (EDT)
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8. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #7
 
   >>
>>
>>>>Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet.
>>>
>>>He's stuck only by his own choice; if the day came that he wanted out,
>>>Gryphon and Grand Admiral Takaya would have a bidding war for his
>>>services. :)
>>
>>They would not be alone in that bidding war, either. }:-{D
>
>Now that is something I'd like to see.
>
>Let me flip a three sided coin....

Save your ningis. On contemplation, I think the one I'd push for recruiting would be Bill Riker. }:-{D

Redneck

Red wizard needs money badly...
www.wlpcomics.com
White Lightning Productions - don't tell the Pope


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Shadowhavoc
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Nov-21-01, 01:21 PM (EDT)
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9. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #8
 
   >>>
>>>
>>>>>Picard - Pity he's stuck in Starfleet.
>>>>
>>>>He's stuck only by his own choice; if the day came that he wanted out,
>>>>Gryphon and Grand Admiral Takaya would have a bidding war for his
>>>>services. :)
>>>
>>>They would not be alone in that bidding war, either. }:-{D
>>
>>Now that is something I'd like to see.
>>
>>Let me flip a three sided coin....
>
>Save your ningis. On contemplation, I think the one I'd push for
>recruiting would be Bill Riker. }:-{D

Hmm, what are ningis?

"Remember kids, only dress in barbed wire if you're a hero. Or drunk *hic*."


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Gryphonadmin
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22374 posts
Nov-21-01, 03:44 PM (EDT)
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12. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #9
 
   >Hmm, what are ningis?

Triangular rubber coins, 6,800 Standard miles on a side. Eight of them make up a Pu in the extremely weird banking system of Triganus IV.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/

-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.


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BobSchroeck
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2258 posts
Nov-21-01, 08:37 AM (EDT)
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6. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #3
 
   >Yes, dammit, for the last time, Stick. That's what it
>is, that's what it's called. But it's not a
>stick, mind you that - it's the Stick. :)

Ah, so it's a Platonic archetype.

<grin>

-- Bob
---------------
500 plastic ducks.
1 world.
Infinite possibilities.
http://www.ifoundaduck.com

-- Bob
-------------------
My race is pacifist and does not believe in war. We kill only out of personal spite.


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Ebony
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Nov-21-01, 03:17 PM (EDT)
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11. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #6
 
   >>Yes, dammit, for the last time, Stick. That's what it
>>is, that's what it's called. But it's not a
>>stick, mind you that - it's the Stick. :)
>
>Ah, so it's a Platonic archetype.
>
><grin>
>

Thought that was Jungian archetype. Or is that just apply to people? In which case, "Stick" applies to a little, old blind pool hustler created by Frank Miller to beat some sense into that young punk, Matt Murdock. Which is what I thought off first when I read the scene.

Actually, I thought, "I am Stone; I feel no pain." but Stone is one of Stick's students. From the Daredevil comic, in case anyone's wondering.

Corwin does have a point, though. You'll never forget the name, and Names have power. Especially when given by a competent Maker like Corwin.

Ebony the Black Dragon
aka Draco Draconis Ebenium
known to Marvel Comics as Aaron F. Johnson,
Senior Editor, Living Room Games
http://www.lrgames.com


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Neophyte
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113 posts
Nov-25-01, 06:03 PM (EDT)
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13. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #11
 
   >>>Yes, dammit, for the last time, Stick. That's what it
>>>is, that's what it's called. But it's not a
>>>stick, mind you that - it's the Stick. :)
>>
>>Ah, so it's a Platonic archetype.
>>
>><grin>
>>
>
>Thought that was Jungian archetype.

It's Platonic Form.

-------
Y. Michael Chang
Mechanical Engineering major, Berkeley, CA


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Wedge
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Nov-21-01, 02:24 AM (EDT)
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5. "RE: Seventh Movement - A Dragon's thoughts"
In response to message #0
 
   >Stick - STICK???

Somewhere in America, for the last 2 days or so, Robert Wuhl's been having the oddest sense of deja vu.

------------------------
Chad Collier--And Burt Reynolds...probably doesn't even remember the movie at this point...
Digital Bitch
J. Random VFX Company


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remandeteam
Member since Jul-31-07
78 posts
Nov-21-01, 02:13 PM (EDT)
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10. "Deedlit's Death"
In response to message #0
 
   >(I've never forgiven you guys for killing Deedlit)

Then we achieved the proper effect.

IMHO, there were way too many spacebound shoot-em-ups where nobody actually gets killed. While this is done to keep it from being disturbing, it sends the message that war doesn't have to be disturbing. It just ain't so.

War is disturbing, even when it's the only choice you have, and it will hurt you. The WDF defeated GENOM that day, but at a terrible price--and Deedlit's death in UF4 serves to remind us how that price is paid.

See Also: Roy Fokker.

--rR

--rR


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Matrix Dragon
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Nov-25-01, 08:14 PM (EDT)
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14. "RE: Deedlit's Death"
In response to message #10
 
   >>(I've never forgiven you guys for killing Deedlit)
>
>Then we achieved the proper effect.
>
>IMHO, there were way too many spacebound shoot-em-ups where nobody
>actually gets killed. While this is done to keep it from being
>disturbing, it sends the message that war doesn't have to be
>disturbing. It just ain't so.
>
>War is disturbing, even when it's the only choice you have,
>and it will hurt you. The WDF defeated GENOM that day, but at a
>terrible price--and Deedlit's death in UF4 serves to remind us how
>that price is paid.
>
>See Also: Roy Fokker.
>
> --rR

Yeah, I understand what you mean. That's what threw me the first time I read UF4. It took me a while to figure out that one of the big characters was actually dead. I'm not annoyed at that so much anymore. I just wish there were more stories in the Golden Age and Exile that included her. I like her character for some reason.

Anyway, these days the world has a far better example of the cost of war.

Matrix Dragon
"Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger." --J.R.R. Tolkien
"Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for obvious reasons." -Matrix Dragon

Matrix Dragon, J. Random Nutter


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