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Subject: "Experts of Justice?" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Matrix Dragon
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Jun-28-01, 10:04 PM (EST)
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"Experts of Justice?"
 
   This has been bugging me ever since I found the first mention of the Experts of Justice. Just what are the details behind them? I know some of the basic members and a few facts, but there's still a lot missing that's driving me crazy. And you sure as all hell didn't help with CR Gryph! Now there's things about Gray Lensmen and such.

I'm not sure I can take much more of this. The bloody thing was distracting me during my chemistry exam two weeks ago, for Gods sake! (Serves me right for reading twilight before going to school, but still....

And just out of curiosity, where'd metaspace come from? The name doesn't ring a bell, but Corwin's description sounds familar.

Matrix Dragon
"So here we are. Back in the same cell we were in a week ago. GOOD THING THEY NEVER FIXED IT!" -Sluugy Freelance


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 1
     RE: Experts of Justice? Matrix Dragon Jun-28-01 2
         RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 3
             RE: Experts of Justice? Star Ranger4 Jun-29-01 15
         RE: Experts of Justice? ejheckathorn Jun-28-01 4
             RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 5
                 RE: Experts of Justice? Matrix Dragon Jun-28-01 7
                     RE: Experts of Justice? ejheckathorn Jun-28-01 9
                         RE: Experts of Justice? jrb Jun-29-01 20
                     RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 10
                         RE: Experts of Justice? Perko Jun-28-01 13
                             RE: Experts of Justice? BobSchroeck Jun-29-01 17
                                 RE: Experts of Justice? Dreamshadow Jun-29-01 18
                                     RE: Experts of Justice? BobSchroeck Jun-29-01 21
                                         RE: Experts of Justice? Perko Jun-29-01 24
                     RE: Experts of Justice? Waylander_the_Slayer Jun-29-01 23
                 RE: Experts of Justice? megazone Jun-28-01 12
                     RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 14
     RE: Experts of Justice? NightmareButterfly Jun-28-01 6
         RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-28-01 8
             RE: Experts of Justice? megazone Jun-28-01 11
                 RE: Experts of Justice? Dreamshadow Jun-29-01 16
                     RE: Experts of Justice? drakensisthered Jun-29-01 25
             RE: Experts of Justice? Mephronmoderator Jun-29-01 19
                 RE: Experts of Justice? Gryphonadmin Jun-29-01 22
                     RE: Experts of Justice? sjpw_prez Sep-24-01 26

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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 10:17 PM (EST)
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1. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #0
 
   >This has been bugging me ever since I found the first mention of the
>Experts of Justice. Just what are the details behind them? I know some
>of the basic members and a few facts, but there's still a lot missing
>that's driving me crazy. And you sure as all hell didn't help with CR
>Gryph! Now there's things about Gray Lensmen and such.

The Experts of Justice (formally, the Interstellar Police Organization) were founded in 2390 as a response to the fact that, following the War of Corporate Occupation, the galaxy got weirder, not more stable. Lensmen are a subset of Experts; Gray Lensmen are a subset of Lensmen. All of that (well, except for the date, but that's in the New Avalon H2G2 writeup) can be glarked from context.

The circumstances surrounding the IPO's founding, as well as more information about the UF version of the Lens and its bearers, will be related in the seventh part of Twilight, assuming Zoner helps me get it done sometime.

>And just out of curiosity, where'd metaspace come from? The name
>doesn't ring a bell, but Corwin's description sounds familar.

Metaspace is basically the version of hyperspace they use in Babylon 5. We already had something called hyperspace, so it got a new name.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Matrix Dragon
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Jun-28-01, 10:29 PM (EST)
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2. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #1
 
   >The Experts of Justice (formally, the Interstellar Police Organization) were >founded in 2390 as a response to the fact that, following the War of Corporate >Occupation, the galaxy got weirder, not more stable. Lensmen are a subset of >Experts; Gray Lensmen are a subset of Lensmen. All of that (well, except for >the date, but that's in the New Avalon H2G2 writeup) can be glarked from >context.
>The circumstances surrounding the IPO's founding, as well as more information >about the UF version of the Lens and its bearers, will be related in the >seventh part of Twilight, assuming Zoner helps me get it done sometime.

Alright, that answers most of my questions there. Now I just gotta wait for part seven of Twilight. Fair enough. Although the Lens are kinda interesting, even if I don't know where they came from. Although Marty has his IN his hand. Yuck.

Matrix Dragon
"I'm a nature boy, like Gryphon from HL."


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 10:35 PM (EST)
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3. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #2
 
   >Alright, that answers most of my questions there. Now I just gotta
>wait for part seven of Twilight. Fair enough. Although the Lens are
>kinda interesting, even if I don't know where they came from. Although
>Marty has his IN his hand. Yuck.

Well, Marty's a Transformer, so the line between man and machine is rather blurry in his case anyway.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Star Ranger4
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Jun-29-01, 00:30 AM (EST)
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15. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #3
 
   >Well, Marty's a Transformer, so the line between man and machine is
>rather blurry in his case anyway.
>

And, it explains why he keeps it ON his hand instead of in a wristband.

Lessee... IIRC, part of the idea behind the Lens was it was ID card and proof of pure heart, for lack of a better term. I forget what other powers it gave the users, though, but if you think about it, clearly the uf's includes a subspace pocket for storing signature weapons like Eiko's hammer.

___________________

Vaughn doesn't know I exist. I guess this explains why the rest of reality keeps ignoring me as well. >_<


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ejheckathorn
Member since Aug-9-13
33 posts
Jun-28-01, 10:41 PM (EST)
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4. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #2
 
   >Alright, that answers most of my questions there. Now I just gotta
>wait for part seven of Twilight. Fair enough. Although the Lens are
>kinda interesting, even if I don't know where they came from. Although
>Marty has his IN his hand. Yuck.

Am I correct in assuming that the inspiration there was E.E. "Doc" Smith's Lensman novels?

Eric J. Heckathorn
ericjh@stargate.net


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 10:46 PM (EST)
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5. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #4
 
   >Am I correct in assuming that the inspiration there was E.E. "Doc"
>Smith's Lensman novels?

What else would it be? :)

Ours work rather differently, though.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Matrix Dragon
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Jun-28-01, 10:53 PM (EST)
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7. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #5
 
   >>Am I correct in assuming that the inspiration there was E.E. "Doc"
>>Smith's Lensman novels?
>What else would it be? :)
>Ours work rather differently, though.

Anyone know where I can find these novels? Once I get them I'll have a bit of a clue about the lenses.

Matrix Dragon
"Christmas Rose. A few days late, but still one of the best birthday presents I got this year."


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ejheckathorn
Member since Aug-9-13
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Jun-28-01, 10:59 PM (EST)
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9. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #7
 
   >Anyone know where I can find these novels? Once I get them I'll have a
>bit of a clue about the lenses.

Well, that might be a bit of a problem. I've been recently trying to acquire the series myself (there's six in all) and am having a problem finding volumes three and five. Amazon.com can't seem to find #3. These are old novels that are considered science fiction classics. They were reprinted a few years back, but are now out of print again. I would say that your best bet is used book stores.

Eric J. Heckathorn
ericjh@stargate.net


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jrb
Member since Jul-16-13
Jun-29-01, 01:10 PM (EST)
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20. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #9
 
   A good place to find rare and hard-to-find books is abebooks.com. I've been able to find every out-of-print book that I was looking for there.

-jrb
Jeff Bradberry


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 11:04 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #7
 
   >Anyone know where I can find these novels? Once I get them I'll have a
>bit of a clue about the lenses.

If you're in the US, I believe they're still in print from Old Earth Books and can be had from amazon.com and such-like.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Perko
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Jun-28-01, 11:16 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #10
 
   Lensmen is great. But don't read it expecting something like today's work - it's old, and although it was written seriously at the time, these days it comes off very... um... well, let's just say that all the crew of their ships are clean-cut and very 'High-ho, what a great ship we serve on. We're happy and honorable and clean-cut!'

And the bad guys, too.

And the aliens.

Of course, that's not BAD. Ask anyone I game over - my tech curve is very Lensmanesque...

-Craig


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BobSchroeck
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Jun-29-01, 08:14 AM (EST)
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17. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #13
 
   >Of course, that's not BAD. Ask anyone I game over - my tech curve is
>very Lensmanesque...

<chuckle> As we came to call it during the GURPS Lensman playtesting, the "Hey -- if we add a tube here, we can go up 2 Tech Levels by the weekend!" effect...

-- Bob
---------------
Come to the Wired. Ask for Lain. I will help you.
-- from Serial Experiments Lain: The Legend Continues


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Dreamshadow
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Jun-29-01, 10:56 AM (EST)
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18. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #17
 
   >>Of course, that's not BAD. Ask anyone I game over - my tech curve is
>>very Lensmanesque...
>
><chuckle> As we came to call it during the GURPS
>Lensman
playtesting, the "Hey -- if we add a tube here, we can
>go up 2 Tech Levels by the weekend!" effect...

You do realise how ungodly characters in the book are? Not that I was put off by that. I thought the book was rather nifty.

Tom 'Dreamshadow' Tjarks
------------------------
What Do You Get When You Cross A Snowman With A Vampire?
Frostbite.


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BobSchroeck
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Jun-29-01, 01:22 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #18
 
   >><chuckle> As we came to call it during the GURPS
>>Lensman
playtesting
>You do realise how ungodly characters in the book are? Not that I was
>put off by that. I thought the book was rather nifty.

Of course we realize(d). They're supposed to be. It's in genre.

<grin>

-- Bob
---------------
Come to the Wired. Ask for Lain. I will help you.
-- from Serial Experiments Lain: The Legend Continues


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Perko
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Jun-29-01, 06:10 PM (EST)
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24. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #21
 
   Me: Well, hell, Kalli, how are you planning on holding a half-light-year thick slab of stone in a spherical shape seventy-two light-years wide?

JM: Er... I concentrate?

Me: ... hot damn, you have enough willpower to do that...

Ha, or ask my players about the Ninja... or Chaos... or Bastard Stars... that was a bit over the top, but it WASN'T MY FAULT! Er, I say that a lot.

-Craig

"Okay, so I need to playtest some more"
-Me


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Waylander_the_Slayer
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Jun-29-01, 05:45 PM (EST)
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23. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #7
 
   >>>Am I correct in assuming that the inspiration there was E.E. "Doc"
>>>Smith's Lensman novels?
>>What else would it be? :)
>>Ours work rather differently, though.
>
>Anyone know where I can find these novels? Once I get them I'll have a
>bit of a clue about the lenses.
>
>Matrix Dragon
>"Christmas Rose. A few days late, but still one of the best birthday
>presents I got this year."


Science Fiction Book Club has all 6 novels as a two volume set titled Chronicles of the Lensmen. Though to read sometimes but good overall


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megazone
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Jun-28-01, 11:09 PM (EST)
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12. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #5
 
   >>Am I correct in assuming that the inspiration there was E.E. "Doc"
>>Smith's Lensman novels?
>
>What else would it be? :)
>
>Ours work rather differently, though.

I see ours as kinda a mix of the Lensman Lens and those things in the back of your hand in Nadesico.

-MegaZone, megazone@megazone.org
Personal Homepage http://www.megazone.org/
Eyrie Productions FanFic http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
See what I'm selling on eBay


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 11:19 PM (EST)
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14. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #12
 
   >>Ours work rather differently, though.
>
>I see ours as kinda a mix of the Lensman Lens and those things in the
>back of your hand in Nadesico.

I don't, since they have nothing whatsoever to do with cybernetic interface. What the hell are you talking about?

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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NightmareButterfly
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Jun-28-01, 10:50 PM (EST)
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6. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #1
 
   >The Experts of Justice (formally, the Interstellar Police
>Organization) were founded in 2390 as a response to the fact that,
>following the War of Corporate Occupation, the galaxy got weirder, not
>more stable. Lensmen are a subset of Experts; Gray Lensmen are a
>subset of Lensmen. All of that (well, except for the date, but that's
>in the New Avalon H2G2 writeup) can be glarked from context.
>

Any relation to the Experts of Justice from Giant Robo?

-Nightmare Butterfly


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Gryphonadmin
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Jun-28-01, 10:58 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #6
 
   >Any relation to the Experts of Justice from Giant Robo?

Inspired by; similar organization (high-level agents with superpowers and cool costumes, lots of lower-level guys in blue jumpsuits). If you didn't notice that Yuri's new motif in Twilight is based on Kenji Murasame, you weren't paying attention. (How she got that way is a story for another time.)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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megazone
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Jun-28-01, 11:08 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #8
 
   >Inspired by; similar organization (high-level agents with superpowers
>and cool costumes, lots of lower-level guys in blue jumpsuits). If
>you didn't notice that Yuri's new motif in Twilight is based on
>Kenji Murasame, you weren't paying attention. (How she got that way
>is a story for another time.)

Yeah, now Marty is going to keep getting false positives when looking for Carmen Sandiego...

"Yuri, were you in Berlin last week?"
"Yeah, why?"
"Oh, nothing..." *mutter*

-MegaZone, megazone@megazone.org
Personal Homepage http://www.megazone.org/
Eyrie Productions FanFic http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
See what I'm selling on eBay


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Dreamshadow
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Jun-29-01, 07:00 AM (EST)
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16. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #11
 
  
Gah....you had to go and do that to me. I hadn't thought about Carmen Sandeigo in a long time. *sigh* Where in Time was the hardest one for me to beat on a regular basis, as it did not give you much time to work with. But I did it!! also credit that game to helping my early investigative skills form.

On another note, the Lensmen novels are interesting, but IMHO a bit hard to read. Now, considering when they were written it doesn't totally surprise me. I got my copies from the Science Fiction Book club. In fact, they sit right next to me here at work, while I'm trying to finish up the second book. These are two books, each containing half of the whole series.

Tom 'Dreamshadow' Tjarks
------------------------
Would Jim Phelps count as a Grey Lensman? Or Just Grey?


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drakensisthered
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Jun-29-01, 06:35 PM (EST)
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25. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #16
 
  
>On another note, the Lensmen novels are interesting, but IMHO a bit
>hard to read. Now, considering when they were written it doesn't
>totally surprise me.

Yeah, 'Doc' Smith's stuff is a favorite of mine. Basically he wrote pulp space adventures with lots of two-fisted, square jawed scientists and engineers who just happen to be crackshots and proficient in a couple of dozen martial arts.
Totally unlike anyone in Undocumented Features?

And the Galactic Patrol's personnel policy always gives me a laugh, and it matches so many anime shows in simplicity.

"You know that problem we had?"
"Yes."
"You sent us your best man to deal wth it."
"With you."
"He's dead."
"Ah."
"What do we do now?"
"We'll just grab the top graduate fresh out of training and with minimal experience, and send him over, shall we?"
"That'll do nicely then."

Not to mention any shows in particular, that reasoning does sound fairly familair for some reason.


drakensisthered

So I simply said one of the great trite truths: "There is generally more than one side to a story." - Corwin, Roger Zelazny's 'Courts of Chaos'


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Mephronmoderator
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Jun-29-01, 11:19 AM (EST)
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19. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #8
 
   >Inspired by; similar organization (high-level agents with superpowers
>and cool costumes, lots of lower-level guys in blue jumpsuits).

Ah, yes, what me and my ex, in a weekend of watching all of GR up to 6 in a series, referred to as the Expendables of Justice. (They go through more of those blue-jumpsuit guys than Genom goes through 55-Cs, looks like.)

>If
>you didn't notice that Yuri's new motif in Twilight is based on
>Kenji Murasame, you weren't paying attention.

I saw it. I boggled. You left out a part of the costume, though.

Either that or she actually TRIMS her bangs instead of letting the HairTumor grow off them... "Kenji Murasame... CAPTAIN AMOEBAHEAD!!"

>(How she got that way
>is a story for another time.)

Of COURSE it is.

--
Geoff Depew - Mephron
"Big O! Showtime!"


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Gryphonadmin
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19255 posts
Jun-29-01, 01:52 PM (EST)
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22. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #19
 
   >>If
>>you didn't notice that Yuri's new motif in Twilight is based on
>>Kenji Murasame, you weren't paying attention.
>
>I saw it. I boggled. You left out a part of the costume, though.
>
>Either that or she actually TRIMS her bangs instead of letting the
>HairTumor grow off them... "Kenji Murasame... CAPTAIN AMOEBAHEAD!!"

Yuri's tend to just hang down and hide one of her eyes, in that impractical-but-fetching way. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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sjpw_prez
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Sep-24-01, 04:07 AM (EST)
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26. "RE: Experts of Justice?"
In response to message #22
 
   On the subject of finding "Lensmen" novels, there is a used book store in Fayetteville Arkansas by the name of "Dickson Street Books" that have #1-#6 there for only $4.50 (plus $.05 tax) and all but #6 are in great condition.

Another used book store is "Crazy Earls" in Fort Smith Arkansas. I don't know how much they are there, but it's not much.

I just thought I'd throw that out there.

Signed,
Todd Vincents
"So, that's a Mimbari Warship?"
"Yep, I don't think they're going to attack us."
"Why do you say that?"
"For one thing, they might have a Warrior Caste and the open gunports might be a sign of respect".
"And the other?"
"I'm crazy enough to believe in peace between a ship that has been enhanced through Romulan tech and built by us than trying to outfight a ship that we can see, but not target."
"Ah, good point Andrew!"
----A conversation between Captain Andrew Slayton and Lt.Cmdr Rex Hall of the AFS Eagle ("Through the Glass Darkly" by Wil Pierce and Greg Sands)


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