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Gryphonadmin
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"H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
 
   The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Standard Edition, 2410


Entertainment >>>
Media >>
Television >

Battlecruiser Vengeance

The most popular television program ever produced in the Klingon Empire, may'Duj bortaS - better known, even among Klingons, by its Standard title, Battlecruiser Vengeance - originally ran from 2376 to 2379 on the Imperial Broadcasting Corporation's empire-wide television network. The 2376-2379 program, now known by the informal nickname Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Original Series or "TOS" for short, chronicled the adventures of Commander Koth and the crew of the battlecruiser IKV bortaS (Vengeance), one of the most famed and highly decorated starships of the fictional Imperial Klingon Warfleet.

Every week, Koth, played by the dynamic and charismatic actor Wilaam sutai-Rentash, led his bold crew of Klingon warriors on another glorious adventure among the stars, bringing honor and fame to the Empire. Koth's closest advisors were the cool and cerebral science officer, Sub-Commander SpoQ, and the ship's volatile surgeon, Ma'Qoy. Their constant bickering provided many of the lighter moments of the show's humor, as well. The Vengeance's regular crew also included the beautiful intelligence officer Nikaal, the daredevil helmsman Karu, master battle engineer Du'Han, and eager young navigation officer ZheQov, who became famous for his belief that every great Klingon invention originated in his native northern province of Meskva.

Imaginatively written but filmed on a very low budget, Battlecruiser Vengeance fared poorly in its initial broadcast airing, possibly because IBC promoted it so lightly. It was actually cancelled at the end of the 2378 season, but a massive letter-writing campaign and several duel challenges from fans convinced the surviving producers to bring show back for one more season. All the same, it still never achieved major success until after its production run ended, when it took off in reruns and became a major cult hit throughout the Empire and beyond. (In 2381, IBC produced a single season of the even-lower-budget Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Animated Series, which has since become a much-sought-after curiosity among Vengeance fans.)

By 2387, the show was so popular in syndication that its original creators began planning a new series, Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Second Campaign. Within a couple of years, the series was shelved in favor of a major motion picture, intended to capitalize on the success of Counterattack, the smash-hit dramatization of the Wedge Defense Force's final defeat of GENOM Corporation. The resulting film, while flawed by its rushed production schedule, cemented the Battlecruiser Vengeance franchise's fame and popularity throughout the galaxy, spawning nine sequels and four further television series.

The TV Series

Battlecruiser Vengeance (aka The Original Series, TOS)
2376-2379

A low-budget military action show originally envisioned as a fill-in series between seasons of the wildly popular Expansion Era period drama Disruptorfire, TOS was designed hurriedly and filmed on a shoestring, and it shows. Producers made the best of a bad situation by making the dilapidated appearance of the Vengeance (really the decommissioned battlecruiser tal'Mach) a recurring plot point, part of Koth's clever plan to make his enemies underestimate him. The quality of episodes varies wildly, from the astonishing "Is There in Death No Honor?" to the apocalyptically bad "... And the Children of Kahless Shall Lead". Fan favorite episodes include "Errand of Conquest", "The Baakonite Maneuver", "The Tholians' Folly", and the show's only out-and-out comedy episode, "The Great Tribble Slaughter of Space Station K-7".

Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Animated Series (aka TAS)
2381

Even lower-budget than TOS, TAS featured the voices of most of the original cast, but the animation was terrible and the writing dumbed down for the anticipated younger audience. The show never really caught on, but a couple of its episodes ("How Sharper than a Traitor's Blade", "The Conquest of Time") are considered important to the franchise's overall canon by some fans. Recordings of TAS were never officially made available, making the show sought after by fans for its rarity and curiosity value, if nothing else.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Next Generation (aka TNG)
2391-2398

More of a science-fiction program than the original, Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Next Generation was set aboard a Klingon warship of the year 2650, complete with extrapolated weapons technologies and a multicultural crew drawn from the four corners of the now-galaxy-spanning Empire, all under the command of Captain Koth, a descendent of TOS's Commander Koth. Non-Klingons were uneasy about its expansionistic message, hardcore Klingons disturbed by the implication that conquered races were shown to be given citizenship and allowed to serve in the military. At its best ("The Best of Both Empires", "Yesterday's Vengeance") it was a great show; at its worst (pretty much all of seasons 1, 2, and 7) it was clunky, preachy, or both. The crew of the future-Vengeance were only seen in a few guest appearances after the series wrapped.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Cardassian War (aka TCW)
2395-2400

Confusing to some viewers because, despite its title, it focused on the exploits of the battlecruiser Defiance and its crew, Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Cardassian War was highly popular anyway because of its pseudo-documentary filming style and the fact that the fictional Imperial Warfleet gave the Cardies a much rougher time than the real KDF did in the real Cardassian War. Historical parallels to the real war, guest appearances by the TOS and TNG Vengeances (including, after the third season, the arrival of the human Sub-Commander Dorn from TNG as a permanent TCW cast member), and the raw intensity of Commander Tzis'Qo added up to a spinoff that's second in popularity to this day.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: Odyssey
2401-2408

The follow-up to The Cardassian War returned the focus to the Vengeance, now with a new crew (Koth became Chancellor of the High Council during TCW and made his command staff his military advisors). In the first episode, the ship, now under the command of the untried Commander Katrin and with a crew infiltrated by Romulan agents, was teleported to the far side of the galaxy by a mysterious, godlike being. So far away that a message will take a hundred years to reach the Homeworld, Katrin has no choice but to cross an almost unimaginable vastness of uncharted territory, fighting every step of the way against a host of bizarre new enemies - and against internal dissention aboard her ship as well. The result is a rich, multilayered Klingon martial drama as well as a series that contains some of the most spectacular space combat action ever filmed. By most modern fans, Odyssey, not TNG, is considered the true successor to the Battlecruiser Vengeance legacy.

Vengeance
2410-present

A brand-new series just launched by IBC, Vengeance steps back hundreds of years into the past, to a time before there was a multistellar Klingon Empire, to chronicle the adventures of the Old Empire's first fully operational starship, named (of course) the Vengeance. Under the command of the valiant Koth (an ancestor of the TOS and TNG Koths, of course), Vengeance explores strange new worlds, seeks out new life and new civilizations, and boldly conquers where no Klingon has conquered before. Though derided by some for its complete disregard of actual history (the first Klingon starship was named, inevitably, the Kahless), the show is loved by others for its freewheeling sense of adventure and the fresh new angles it brings while dramatizing real events like the Klingons' first contact with the Salusians and the colonization of the very first Klingon colony world, Klinzhai Prime.

>>> Continued in File 2: The Movies


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance JeanneHedge Feb-03-05 1
     RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Gryphonadmin Feb-03-05 2
         RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance JeanneHedge Feb-03-05 8
             RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Gryphonadmin Feb-03-05 11
  RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Offsides Feb-03-05 3
  I just want you to know... mdg1 Feb-03-05 4
  H2G2 cont'd Gryphonadmin Feb-03-05 5
     RE: H2G2 cont'd PBL Feb-04-05 14
     RE: H2G2 cont'd beautifulvoice Feb-06-05 30
         RE: H2G2 cont'd Gryphonadmin Feb-06-05 31
  Just so you all know, Gryphonadmin Feb-03-05 6
     RE: Just so you all know, stgermain Feb-03-05 7
     RE: Just so you all know, E_M_Lurker Feb-04-05 13
         RE: Just so you all know, JeanneHedge Feb-04-05 15
             RE: Just so you all know, Mephronmoderator Feb-04-05 16
                 RE: Just so you all know, JeanneHedge Feb-04-05 17
                 RE: Just so you all know, BobSchroeck Feb-04-05 18
                     RE: Just so you all know, StClair Feb-07-05 33
     RE: Just so you all know, SpottedKitty Feb-05-05 24
  RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance BobSchroeck Feb-03-05 9
     RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Gryphonadmin Feb-03-05 10
         RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Il Corra Feb-04-05 12
             RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance BobSchroeck Feb-04-05 20
         RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance BobSchroeck Feb-04-05 19
  RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance RedOtakuKeith Feb-04-05 21
     RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Gryphonadmin Feb-04-05 22
         RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Meagen Feb-05-05 23
             RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance trigger Feb-05-05 25
                 RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance jadmire Feb-05-05 26
  RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance jadmire Feb-05-05 27
     RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance Gryphonadmin Feb-05-05 28
         RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance E_M_Lurker Feb-05-05 29
     RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance BobSchroeck Feb-06-05 32

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JeanneHedge
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Feb-03-05, 04:20 PM (EDT)
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1. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #0
 
   >The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
>Standard Edition, 2410
>
>
>Entertainment >>>
>Media >>
>Television >
>
>Battlecruiser Vengeance

This was a fun read, made even more entertaining was parsing everything back to the history of Trek. Although in some cases, I think I'd prefer to watch Battlecruiser Vengeance or its descendants

>Vengeance
>2410-present

I hope Vengeance suffered a better fate than the now-cancelled Enterprise did.


Jeanne



Jeanne Hedge
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http://go.compuserve.com/Comic


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-03-05, 04:49 PM (EDT)
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2. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #1
 
   >>Vengeance
>>2410-present
>
>I hope Vengeance suffered a better fate than the now-cancelled
>Enterprise did.

Yeah, that's kind of sad news. I haven't actually been able to watch Enterprise since a few episodes into the first season (my satellite rig doesn't carry a UPN station), and I've been told in terms of varying vehemence that it never really found its legs, but I liked the cast and the premise, and whatever the reason for its failure, I'm disappointed that it failed.

Vengeance is still on the air as of the "present day" in UF (it's just about to premiere at the end of Symphony No. 4), and production is continuing despite the Klingon Civil War that started in The Revolution Will Be Televised, but it remains to be seen how many people in the fractured Empire are going to be in the mood to watch TV. It'll probably still be big outside Klingon space, though some Klingon historians worry that it will give outsiders a completely false idea of the Empire's history.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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JeanneHedge
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Feb-03-05, 08:19 PM (EDT)
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8. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #2
 
   >>>Vengeance
>>>2410-present
>>
>>I hope Vengeance suffered a better fate than the now-cancelled
>>Enterprise did.
>
>Yeah, that's kind of sad news. I haven't actually been able to watch
>Enterprise since a few episodes into the first season (my
>satellite rig doesn't carry a UPN station), and I've been told in
>terms of varying vehemence that it never really found its legs, but I
>liked the cast and the premise, and whatever the reason for its
>failure, I'm disappointed that it failed.

Whatever its past failures, this season has been pretty good. (once the new producer, Manny Cota, got the story out from under that "temporal aliens and Nazis" arc leftover by Brannon and Braga, that is)


>Vengeance is still on the air as of the "present day" in
>UF (it's just about to premiere at the end of Symphony No.
>4
), and production is continuing despite the Klingon Civil War
>that started in The Revolution Will Be Televised, but it
>remains to be seen how many people in the fractured Empire are going
>to be in the mood to watch TV. It'll probably still be big outside
>Klingon space, though some Klingon historians worry that it will give
>outsiders a completely false idea of the Empire's history.

I imagine Commodore Tenjou will be arranging to watch it weekly ^_^


Jeanne



Jeanne Hedge
http://www.jhedge.com
http://go.compuserve.com/Comic


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-03-05, 10:18 PM (EDT)
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11. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #8
 
   >>Vengeance is still on the air as of the "present day" in
>>UF
>
>I imagine Commodore Tenjou will be arranging to watch it weekly ^_^

Oh, well, yeah, it'll be on Avalon 17, which Tomodachi SatCom carries. They'll TiVo it and then watch it on Saturdays with Kraalgh. Utena's good enough at Klingonese at this point that they don't need to turn the subtitles on any more, though Kate still gets a bit lost sometimes.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Offsides
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Feb-03-05, 05:58 PM (EDT)
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3. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #0
 
   More than anything else, I love what you did with the names of the cast and characters. A wonderful parody of the history of Star Trek, as seen through the Klingon viewpoint.

Kai the Editor-in-Chief! :)

Offsides

[...] in order to be a realist you must believe in miracles.
-- David Ben Gurion
EPU RCW #π
#include <stdsig.h>


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mdg1
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Feb-03-05, 06:31 PM (EDT)
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4. "I just want you to know..."
In response to message #0
 
   You frighten me.

Mario


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Gryphonadmin
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5. "H2G2 cont'd"
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON Feb-03-05 AT 07:40 PM (EST)
 
<<< continued from File 1

The Movies

Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Motion Picture (aka TMP)
2389

The first big-screen Vengeance adventure, TMP brought the original cast back together under the leadership of Commander Koth, who gives up a promotion to general in order to lead his old crew back into battle aboard a newly-renovated, cutting-edge version of their faithful battlecruiser. Koth and his crew must race to the edge of the Empire in order to head off a mysterious alien vessel which is on a direct course for Kronos. Time may be running out for the whole Klingon race, and only Koth and the Vengeance can save them! Though marred by some pacing and editing problems caused by its extremely aggressive production schedule, TMP was still a triumph for everyone who had worked and hoped to bring Battlecruiser Vengeance back. Its popularity led directly to the rest of the movie franchise and made possible the production of the subsequent television series, and its beautifully redesigned Vengeance was so well-liked that Kronos Heavy Industries based the next revision of the real-life k't'Inga-class heavy cruiser on its look.

Battlecruiser Vengeance II: The Wrath of Kor
2391

Captain Kor swore revenge against Koth and the Vengeance in the TOS episode "Seed of Destruction". He returns to exact it in The Wrath of Kor, the most popular of all the Vengeance movies. The film features a magnificent performance by actor Kol'Hos, a Klingon national treasure, as Koth's revenge-obsessed rival captain, and the battles between the Vengeance and Kor's Black Death rocked audiences all over the galaxy. The film was truly stunning, though, for the heroic and glorious death of Sub-Commander SpoQ.

Battlecruiser Vengeance III: The Search for SpoQ
2392

General Koth defies the High Council in order to undertake the most daring mission of his entire career: to take the Vengeance to the gates of Sto-Vo-Kor itself and demand the return of his most trusted shipmate, Sub-Commander SpoQ. The effort succeeds, but at a terrible price. The Vengeance is destroyed, and Koth and his crewmates find themselves wanted fugitives, stranded on Romulus. This film marked the directing debut of nI'moy, the actor who played SpoQ.

Battlecruiser Vengeance IV: The Glorious Return
2393

After months in hiding on Romulus, Koth and his crew attack a naval base, seize an new Romulan Warbird, and use its experimental weaponry to destroy a planet-eating alien machine which threatens to consume Kronos. For saving the Homeworld and securing the Romulan prize, the crew is pardoned, except for Koth; he is busted back to Commander and assigned to command a brand new Vengeance! Also directed by nI'moy, Battlecruiser Vengeance IV featured some of the franchise's lightest, most charming humor, including the unforgettably droll scene in which ma'Qoy challenges SpoQ to a duel in response to SpoQ's assertion that only one who has been to Sto-Vo-Kor can truly understand what it is like.

Battlecruiser Vengeance V: The False God
2395

Koth and his crew are having trouble with the new Vengeance. Though it's the same class as their old ship, it behaves differently, lacking the familiar quirks and idiosyncrasies of the original. They're distracted from their woes by the arrival of Science Officer SpoQ's brother Sy'boQ, a perverse individual who has founded a cult of Klingons who think themselves pacifists. Sy'boQ hijacks the Vengeance through cowardly means and takes it on a journey to the Galactic Core, where he hopes to meet an omnipotent being who created the universe. Instead, he finds there only the fate of all who cross Koth of the Vengeance. Directed by Wilaam sutai-Rentash, who played the original Koth in his every appearance, Battlecruiser Vengeance V was an ambitious production, but it never really caught on with fans, who felt that Rentash had belabored Koth's importance to the Empire somewhat and not featured the other members of the Vengeance's crew prominently enough.

Battlecruiser Vengeance VI: The Unconquered Country
2397

Koth and ma'Qoy are framed for the murder of the Federation President in an attempt by radical members of both the Federation Senate and the Klingon High Council to destabilize the Klingon-Zetan alliance. While the two plot their escape from the Federation prison at Crematoria, it's up to SpoQ and the rest of the Vengeance crew to fight their way to Earth and deliver the evidence that will clear their captain and the doctor. The last Battlecruiser Vengeance movie to feature the entire original cast, The Unconquered Country was seen as a landmark film, affirming the producers' belief in the Empire's controversial alliance with Zeta Cygni and foreseeing the eventual Earth-Zeta Cygni split that has come to dominate Federation politics today.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: Generations
2398

The seventh film in the series dropped the numbering and featured a story that brought together characters from TOS and Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Next Generation. The parts of it featuring the TNG cast were filmed at the same time as principal photography for Battlecruiser Vengeance VI, enabling Generations to come out only six months later. A time anomaly strands Koth, SpoQ, and ma'Qoy in the year 2653, while simultaneously depositing TNG-Koth, Sub-Commander RiH'r, and Lieutenant Dorn aboard the Vengeance of the TOS era. The two Koths must get used to leading each other's crews and working each other's vessels in order to defeat the malicious aliens who caused them to become timelost and return to their own eras.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: First Conflict
2400

Released just before the series finale of Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Cardassian War aired on television, First Conflict featured both the Vengeance and the Defiance in another time-travel story which flung both vessels back to the earliest days of Klingon history. They arrive in the ancient past just in time to witness the first attempt by an alien species to invade pre-spaceflight Kronos. With the evil Romulans plotting to tilt the balance in the aliens' favor and prevent the Klingon people from ever achieving spaceflight, Koth and Tzis'Qo must do all they can to help the early Klingons win without inflicting their own catastrophic changes on history. (First Conflict was the last appearance of Koth as commander of the Vengeance. In his next appearance, in the Cardassian War series finale "The Scars You Leave Behind", he is named Chancellor of the Klingon High Council.)

Battlecruiser Vengeance: Counter-Insurrection
2404

The cast of Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Cardassian War returned after a four-year hiatus for this film, in which General Tzis'Qo must take command of the Defiance once again in order to put down a revolt on occupied Cardassia. The timing of the revolt makes little sense, since Chancellor Koth had announced his intention to end the occupation within the year anyway, and he orders his old friend Tzis'Qo to get to the bottom of the Cardassians' strange behavior. The truth will turn out to be far more sinister than either Klingon could have imagined. Counter-Insurrection was unpopular with fans because of the perfunctory and needless death of Commander Warren Dorn, the popular human officer first introduced in Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Next Generation. Dorn, who became the first non-Klingon to command a Warfleet vessel at the end of The Cardassian War when he succeeded Tzis'Qo as commander of the Defiance, is assassinated by the Cardassian rebels in the first 10 minutes of the film, thus making Tzis'Qo's efforts later in the film a blood revenge. Critics of this manipulative move note that Tzis'Qo had plenty of motivation to deal harshly with the Cardassians anyway, and maintain that a character as well-loved as Dorn should have been given a more honorable exit if killing him off were necessary at all.

Battlecruiser Vengeance: Nemesis
2407

The first (and so far only) Battlecruiser Vengeance: Odyssey movie, Nemesis pits Commander Katrin and her by-now-battle-hardened crew (the film is set between the sixth and seventh seasons of Odyssey) against none other than Commander Kor, the arch-foe of the Vengeance's original commander, Koth. Kor's ship, last seen being blown to smithereens by the Nemesis Device at the end of Battlecruiser Vengeance II: The Wrath of Kor, is revealed to have been hurled halfway across the galaxy by the ill-understood weapon's blast instead. Now, more deranged than ever and so deluded he thinks Katrin is Koth, he believes he is exacting his final revenge against his lifelong enemy. Where Counter-Insurrection is disliked by Cardassian Wars fans for the killing off of Commander Dorn, Nemesis is held in high esteem by Odyssey fans for the glorious and noble death of Battle Engineer Xaana, the half-human technical wizard of the Odyssey cast - even if she was hokily brought back in the first episode of Odyssey's seventh season. Interestingly, Nemesis also featured a marked relaxing of the franchise's usually unsympathetic attitude toward Romulans: A Romulan cruiser, stranded the same way as the Vengeance was to set up the series, helps the Vengeance defeat Kor.

The Future of Battlecruiser Vengeance

As noted in the first file, the current show, Vengeance, is still in production despite the ongoing Klingon Civil War. The show is produced on Klinzhai Prime, interim capital of the Krojaar government, and so far has been able to avoid having to take any kind of position on the Civil War thanks to its distant-past setting.

Rumors abound regarding the next Battlecruiser Vengeance feature film. Some believe it will be another Odyssey movie, showing the continuing adventures of General Katrin and her crew now that the Vengeance has returned to the Empire. Others think it will be a Vengeance film, possibly featuring a time-travel plot that will allow the use of some characters from Odyssey or The Cardassian War. A few diehards are calling for a Next Generation revival on the big screen. Some even believe that the show's producers are in talks with Kanzaki Studios of Ishiyama and the International Police Organization about a Battlecruiser Vengeance co-production guest-starring the IPO starship Valiant and her famous crew, with Chancellor Koth, General Katrin, and Captain Tenjou fighting to wrest the empire away from the traitorous and dishonorable Klayvor vestai-Klavaar.

If anyone knows for sure, they're not talking. There has been no official announcement from anyone regarding the cast, concept, or even era of the next Battlecruiser Vengeance movie. All anyone knows for certain is that there will be one.


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PBL
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Feb-04-05, 09:18 AM (EDT)
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14. "RE: H2G2 cont'd"
In response to message #5
 
   All anyone knows for certain is that there will be one.

Will there, now?

This entire concept rocks.


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beautifulvoice
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Feb-06-05, 05:29 AM (EDT)
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30. "RE: H2G2 cont'd"
In response to message #5
 
   LAST EDITED ON Feb-06-05 AT 05:32 AM (EST)
 
I know it's a meta-question, but it's been stuck around my mind all day, so, here goes...does B'elanna consider Xaana an inspiration, a coincidence, or does she not watch Battlecruiser Vengance?

Edit: really bad grammar.


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Gryphonadmin
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31. "RE: H2G2 cont'd"
In response to message #30
 
   >I know it's a meta-question, but it's been stuck around my mind all
>day, so, here goes...does B'elanna consider Xaana an inspiration, a
>coincidence, or does she not watch Battlecruiser Vengance?

Sure she watches it. Odyssey was just getting into the Really Good Part when she started hanging around at DSM. Xaana's example wasn't mentioned as one of B'Elanna's influences when she decided to become an engineer (for the simple reason that I hadn't made any of this up at the time), but it was probably somewhere in her mind.

B'Elanna has a lot of influences, though. Her biggest inspiration isn't a television character; that honor goes to Chief Warrant Officer Miles O'Brien, chief engineer of Babylon 6, whom young B'Elanna quickly became determined to be Just Like (modulo being a female half-Klingon rather than an Irishman). So great was O'Brien's formative influence on B'Elanna's engineering career that as a young adult, when she curses at recalcitrant equipment, she does so with a hint of an Irish accent, despite having no such thing when speaking normally.

Others include Professor Kraalgh, Sub-Commander Klaang, and the crew of the battlecruiser HoSghaj, all of whom taught her that one can be a Klingon without being a pointlessly violent, humorless creep; Zefram Cochrane, whose example shows that you can get away with a lot when you're brilliant; Engineering Officer Vikaris of the Lorica, B'Elanna's canonical case study for doing more with less; Mia Ausa, who carries her dual heritage with more aplomb than B'Elanna believes she can ever aspire to; and Commander William T. Riker of the Federation starship Enterprise, who's just got it together, you know?

As for Xaana, well, I'm sure B'Elanna felt her acceptance by her crewmates was a bit hokey at first, but that was largely because she missed the second-season arc where everyone else on the Vengeance found out Xaana was half-human in the first place. Nobody was offering to get her raktajino for her in that episode, for sure.

--G.
["I wish I looked half that good after six hours up a Jefferies tube."]
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-03-05, 06:56 PM (EDT)
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6. "Just so you all know,"
In response to message #0
 
   though most of the embellishment here is mine, I didn't invent Battlecruiser Vengeance itself. It's the creation of the very excellent John M. Ford, who wrote the very excellent Star Trek novels The Final Reflection and How Much for Just the Planet?

The UF universe's Klingon culture takes much from Ford's pre-TNG vision of them, in addition to the obvious material drawn from the TNG era's "canonical" Klingons. For example, the game klin zha, mentioned by Captain Krontep in S1M7: Reflections in Transition, is the Klingon national game in The Final Reflection, and the phrase kai kassai as a salute is from Ford's Klingon language.

In Ford's novels, Battlecruiser Vengeance is mentioned as a favorite program of some of the characters, including Captain Krenn in The Final Reflection. The theme song is sung by a group of characters at one point in that novel, by way of saluting/inspiring Krenn.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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stgermain
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Feb-03-05, 07:31 PM (EDT)
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7. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #6
 
   I am breaking, loudly, at work.

Star Trek shoved through a Klingon looking glass is a sight to behold, indeed.

Kai the Editor!


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E_M_Lurker
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Feb-04-05, 03:44 AM (EDT)
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13. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #6
 
   >though most of the embellishment here is mine, I didn't invent
>Battlecruiser Vengeance itself. It's the creation of the very
>excellent John M. Ford, who wrote the very excellent Star Trek novels
>The Final Reflection and How Much for Just the Planet?

Kai Ford, kai the folks at FASA (whose names I sadly forget) with whom he co-developed the Real Klingons, and kai the entire Eyrie.

You guys give me the only taste of proper Klingons there is these days...

--Sam
"One of these days, milkshake--BOOM!"


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JeanneHedge
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Feb-04-05, 11:37 AM (EDT)
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15. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #13
 
   >>though most of the embellishment here is mine, I didn't invent
>>Battlecruiser Vengeance itself. It's the creation of the very
>>excellent John M. Ford, who wrote the very excellent Star Trek novels
>>The Final Reflection and How Much for Just the Planet?
>
>Kai Ford,

Maybe the best book of all the Trek series. Diane Duane had some good ones back then too. Too bad Paramount put the kibosh on Trek writers doing their own things with the franchise shortly after.


Jeanne



Jeanne Hedge
http://www.jhedge.com
http://go.compuserve.com/Comic


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Mephronmoderator
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Feb-04-05, 12:06 PM (EDT)
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16. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #15
 
   >Maybe the best book of all the Trek series. Diane Duane had some good
>ones back then too. Too bad Paramount put the kibosh on Trek writers
>doing their own things with the franchise shortly after.

Well, Diane Duane did two more books in her particular version of things with the Romulans, and I'm hoping for more, cause the fourth one left us on a cliffhanger.

And I'd maim for a companion to 'Uhura's Song' by Janet Kagan, who gave us an engaging character who wasn't an obvious Mary Sue, but was fun.

--
Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
"And Remember! Google is yor Friend!!"


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JeanneHedge
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Feb-04-05, 01:36 PM (EDT)
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17. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #16
 
   LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-05 AT 01:37 PM (EST)
 
>And I'd maim for a companion to 'Uhura's Song' by Janet Kagan, who
>gave us an engaging character who wasn't an obvious Mary Sue, but was
>fun.

I loved that book. I'd almost maim someone for the further adventures of Tailkinker to-Ennien :)

(not Trek, but I'm also very fond of Kagan's book "Hellspark")


Jeanne



Jeanne Hedge
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BobSchroeck
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Feb-04-05, 06:26 PM (EDT)
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18. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #16
 
   >And I'd maim for a companion to 'Uhura's Song' by Janet Kagan, who
>gave us an engaging character who wasn't an obvious Mary Sue, but was
>fun.

Huh. I have actually heard of that particular book referred to as "Mary Sue's Song", so there must be a vast difference of opinion on it out there...

-- Bob
-------------------
Then the horns kicked in...
And my shoes started to squeak.


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StClair
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Feb-07-05, 02:41 PM (EDT)
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33. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #18
 
   Let's face it - Tailkinker, and Piper, and even much-beloved Ael are all "Sues" to some degree. What separates them (and UF itself, IMO) from the majority of bad fanfic is that they're written well enough to be entertaining anyway.

(What is it about Trek and/or Trek novels that brings out the Sues? Even big names like J.M. Dillard are not immune...)


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SpottedKitty
Member since Jun-15-04
605 posts
Feb-05-05, 01:49 PM (EDT)
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24. "RE: Just so you all know,"
In response to message #6
 
   >In Ford's novels, Battlecruiser Vengeance is mentioned as a
>favorite program of some of the characters, including Captain Krenn in
>The Final Reflection. The theme song is sung by a group of
>characters at one point in that novel, by way of saluting/inspiring
>Krenn.

And BV also appears in Rules of Engagement by Peter Morwood (Diane Duane's husband, btw) in which an enterprising Enterprise crewman converts the "non-Federation-standard" tapes so they can be shown on the big screen in the Rec Room.

Just as two visiting captains drop in for a moment.

And yes, Gytha "Call Me Captain" North is a real person, I've met her, and her characterisation in Morwood's book is spot on.

--
Cry "Squeak" and let loose the Four Ferrets of the Apocalypse!


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BobSchroeck
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Feb-03-05, 08:56 PM (EDT)
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9. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #0
 
   >(including, after the third season, the arrival of
>the human Sub-Commander Dorn from TNG as a permanent TCW cast member),

I gotta know -- did they actually cast a human, or was he played by a Klingon wearing a rubber lack-of-forehead prosthetic?

-- Bob
-------------------
Then the horns kicked in...
And my shoes started to squeak.


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-03-05, 10:03 PM (EDT)
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10. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #9
 
   >>(including, after the third season, the arrival of
>>the human Sub-Commander Dorn from TNG as a permanent TCW cast member),
>
>I gotta know -- did they actually cast a human, or was he played by a
>Klingon wearing a rubber lack-of-forehead prosthetic?

Neither, but closer to case 2 - he was played by a Klingon who had undergone a variation of the Salusian "humanization" process. One doesn't see humanized Klingons often any more, but it was once a pretty common practice, back in the United Galactica days. The effect is quite convincing - more so than it is on Salusians, in fact, though they still end up looking kind of swarthy and have weird eyebrows.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Il Corra
Member since Feb-17-04
51 posts
Feb-04-05, 03:22 AM (EDT)
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12. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #10
 
   >One
>doesn't see humanized Klingons often any more, but it was once a
>pretty common practice, back in the United Galactica days. The effect
>is quite convincing - more so than it is on Salusians, in fact, though
>they still end up looking kind of swarthy and have weird eyebrows.

And those would be TOS-klingons, right? Nice :)

--
Il Corra


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BobSchroeck
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2258 posts
Feb-04-05, 06:28 PM (EDT)
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20. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #12
 
   >And those would be TOS-klingons, right?

<WORF>We do not speak of it.</WORF>

-- Bob
-------------------
Then the horns kicked in...
And my shoes started to squeak.


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BobSchroeck
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Feb-04-05, 06:28 PM (EDT)
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19. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #10
 
   > The effect
>is quite convincing - more so than it is on Salusians, in fact, though
>they still end up looking kind of swarthy and have weird eyebrows.

'Scuse me whilst I trot over to a nearby corner and laugh myself silly.

Just for that bit alone, I must join the chorus: Kai Gryphon! Kai Eyrie!

-- Bob
-------------------
Then the horns kicked in...
And my shoes started to squeak.


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RedOtakuKeith
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Feb-04-05, 07:43 PM (EDT)
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21. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON Feb-05-05 AT 01:38 PM (EST)
 
One of UF's most inspired little touches gets a well-deserved write-up. I absolutely love the adaptation or turning on their heads of so many things from Star Trek. (Edit: Once again I am shocked to discover that something incredibly cool wasn't an original creation of the authors. Oh well. The development and embellishment of it rocks anyway.)

The comments about how fans view the different series are interesting, because they differ in places from my experience of real Star Trek fandom. In my university Star Trek society and among other people I know who like Trek, Voyager and Enterprise are almost universally derided (particularly Voyager's later seasons and Enterprise's earlier ones). Personally, I like DS9 best, don't mind most of Voyager, only like bits of TNG, and wince at all the pointless nudity/sexuality in Enterprise (though I like Season 3 and have a thing for Hoshi). Do the comments on the popularity of Battlecruiser Venegeance's different series reflect the opinions of the author(s), or are they intentionally different?

Also, did the human Star Trek exist in the UFverse pre-Core (obviously the series and seasons that appeared after 1991 wouldn't have)? If it did, Battlecruiser Venegeance would presumably have drawn comparisons with it.


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-04-05, 09:17 PM (EDT)
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22. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #21
 
   LAST EDITED ON Feb-04-05 AT 09:21 PM (EST)
 
>Do the comments on the popularity of Battlecruiser Venegeance's different
>series reflect the opinions of the author(s), or are they
>intentionally different?

Bit of both, depending on my whim at that particular point in the file. For example, the rundown on Battlecruiser Vengeance (TOS) is pretty much in line with my own opinion of Star Trek (TOS). Some episodes were startlingly good for episodes of a cheesy, low-budget '60s TV series ("The Doomsday Machine", "Balance of Terror", "The Enterprise Incident"); most were about what you'd expect from such a show; and some were just jaw-droppingly lame ("Spock's Brain", "For the World Is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky"). Ditto for TNG. When it was good, it was great; when it was bad, it was usually annoying.

Deep Space Nine and The Cardassian War are roughly equivalent as well, though TCW was shorter than DS9 (it only ran 5 seasons), reflecting the fact that the Klingons would have skipped the first two seasons' worth of dicking around and gotten straight to the part about the Giant Space War.

Odyssey is basically a mirror of Voyager. It has the same essential premise, but lacks pretty much all of Voyager's extreme regrettability. Which is logical - I mean, the basic Voyager premise is the kind of setup that any Klingon crew would see as a glorious challenge. They wouldn't just forlornly dust themselves off and try to make their way home without offending anybody; they'd fight their way back to the Homeworld, and any beings foolish enough to stand in their way would learn the folly of crossing the Vengeance. Add Commander Katrin's struggle to crush the enemy agents among her crew and win the respect of the rest, and it makes sense that it would be the most popular BV franchise since the original show.

I've not yet been able to see enough of Enterprise to form a real judgment of it, so my take on Vengeance is informed more by comments I've heard from people around me. There seem to be two basic camps regarding Enterprise: those who think it's a horrible travesty that never should have been created, and those who think it's a horrible travesty that could have been cool if it had been implemented by someone other than Berman and Braga. I was kinder to Vengeance and at least made one of those camps somewhat positive toward the actual show. :)

One thing to keep in mind is that, except for Battlecruiser Vengeance: The Next Generation, BV isn't speculative fiction. It's a military action/drama show set in a vaguely-defined "present day". To a Klingon living in the UF universe's 25th-century Klingon Empire, the Battlecruiser Vengeance experience is more like watching CSI than Star Trek.

>Also, did the human Star Trek exist in the UFverse pre-Core (obviously
>the series and seasons that appeared after 1991 wouldn't have)?

Don't investigate this too closely - it leads to a lot of annoying metaquestions like "Has Admiral Kirk seen the Star Trek movies, and if so, did he therefore know to put up his shields and start shooting when Reliant showed up and wouldn't answer hails?", which I don't care to get into - but there's a scene in UF3 where Truss is watching Star Trek V: The Final Frontier.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Meagen
Member since Jul-14-02
567 posts
Feb-05-05, 06:42 AM (EDT)
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23. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #22
 
   >>Also, did the human Star Trek exist in the UFverse pre-Core (obviously
>>the series and seasons that appeared after 1991 wouldn't have)?
>
>Don't investigate this too closely - it leads to a lot of annoying
>metaquestions

My personal theory is that when the universe was destroyed and re-made in Core 4, Earth's history was slightly altered so that none of its pre-Contact popular culture matches up exactly with any "modern" races or people. There may still be a few superficial similarities, but nothing an average researcher can't discard as coincidence (in a "Jules Verne writing about submarines and travel to the Moon" sort of way).

Gryph, Zoner and the others who lived through the pause may actually remember some of the Star Trek stuff as it "really" was, but I imagine it's just one of those things they never talk about, even amongst themselves.

--
With great power come great perks.


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trigger
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Feb-05-05, 03:21 PM (EDT)
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25. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #23
 
  
>My personal theory is that when the universe was destroyed and re-made
>in Core 4, Earth's history was slightly altered so that none of its
>pre-Contact popular culture matches up exactly with any "modern" races
>or people. There may still be a few superficial similarities, but
>nothing an average researcher can't discard as coincidence (in a
>"Jules Verne writing about submarines and travel to the Moon" sort of
>way).

hmm. I always thought that the characters believe that one day they simply woke up in a completely different universe, or that something happened to make fiction, reality. In a matter of speaking, within canon, that's true, although only the folks drawn to the bridge of the Wandering Child during the final battle with Genom know what caused it (or think they know).

Look to R-type and Redneck's response to the sudden wierdness in this lives. They know something's up, but they roll with it because it's much, much cooler to think these things are real. As for everyone else on earth, remember that the source materials showing up on Earth in the late 20th century have a limited audience of people, who by their tastes and nature, want to believe.

As for the final question, it's pretty clear only certain Earth cultural objects survived into the 24th century - Earth was racked by warfare and several near apocalyses. Despite simliarities to 20th century Earth, it's a different place with completely different cultures. There's no reason to think the average person has seen a bad american sitcom from the 1960's any more than we see the plays of shakespeare's contemporaries on screen. Pop culture tends to have a short half-life.

And it probably helps that none of the folks who survived long enough to know how certain people might be haven't told them, which is wiser then 9/10ths of most immortals or time travelers.

cheers,
t.

Trigger Argee
trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"If we are marked to die, we are enough
To do our country loss; and if to live,
The fewer men, the greater the share of honour
God's will I pray thee wish not one man more" - Henry V, Act, IV Scene III


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jadmire
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Feb-05-05, 08:26 PM (EDT)
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26. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #25
 
   Considering that Gryphon himself has said that UF4, "Crossroads", is very badly constructed in spots in comparison to the Symphony and other recent works, I'm a little bit wary of taking the part where Our Heroes were scooped up while the universe was, well, basically rebooted as absolute gospel. My own opinion has always been that UF is, in a way, alternate history - the POD (point of divergence), after all, is 1991, now 14 years in the past, so as of 2005 a lot of key events in early UF history, such as First Contact with the Salusians, the destruction of Worcester, the creation of the CFMF, and so forth, are all past-history events. In fact, I'd take it further and say that pre-1991, the UF universe that Gryphon and the other core Wedge Defenders were born into was subtly different from our continuum, mostly at the pop-culture level; which is to say that all the SF shows, anime, movies, etc. that provide the source material for UF didn't exist in the UFverse, at least not in the same forms we know. For example, maybe the UFverse analogue to Star Trek TOS _is_ called "Wagon Train to the Stars", as Roddenberry originally pitched it to network executives, with accompanying differences in characters, ship design, etc. Superficially similiar - maybe similiar enough, in fact, that G and the others would notice parallels here and there - but different enough that those parallels would be written off as cases of life imitating art.

Then again, there _is_ that bit from UF3 Gryphon mentioned about Truss watching ST5...

-Joe-


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jadmire
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Feb-05-05, 08:30 PM (EDT)
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27. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #0
 
   One of the best H2G2 entries yet IMO. I always liked John Ford's version of the Klingon language better than the "canonical" Klingon language so it tickles my fancy to see his vision incorporated so neatly into UF. (Not that I ever expect to see it in UF, but I always liked Diane Duane's version of the Romulans better than the canonical Romulans, particularly the TNG version; she spent as much time and effort as Ford in developing a believable language and culture for her Rihannsu, and Ael is one of my favorite non-canonical Trek characters.)

-Joe-


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Gryphonadmin
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Feb-05-05, 08:43 PM (EDT)
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28. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #27
 
   >(Not that I ever expect to see it in UF, but I always
>liked Diane Duane's version of the Romulans better than the canonical
>Romulans

Meh, I've never been all that enamored of the Space Welsh. If the UF universe's Romulans ever get appreciable screen time beyond the crew of the Lorica, I'll probably devise my own interpretation, following mainly on what little was seen of them in TOS.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Admin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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E_M_Lurker
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Feb-05-05, 10:14 PM (EDT)
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29. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #28
 
   >I've never been all that enamored of the Space Welsh.

As a raving Duane fan I ought to be mortally offended by that, but I'm too busy laughing. :)

--Sam
"I seek... Pez!"


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BobSchroeck
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Feb-06-05, 03:35 PM (EDT)
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32. "RE: H2G2: Battlecruiser Vengeance"
In response to message #27
 
   > I always
>liked Diane Duane's version of the Romulans better than the canonical
>Romulans, particularly the TNG version; she spent as much time and
>effort as Ford in developing a believable language and culture for her
>Rihannsu

Culture, maybe, but when I asked her about it once, back in the late 80s, Diane fessed up that the Rihannsu language is mostly randomly-generated words. Of course, in the years and books since then, she may have put more effort into actually turning it into a realistic tongue, and I may be completely out of date.

(One of Diane's other Trek innovations I liked, while we're near the topic, is her take on Vulcans, seen when the captives are rescued in the one book -- blonde Vulcans, red-headed Vulcans, all kindsa Vulcans, to the amazement of the humans there. Kinda presaged Tim Russ' black Vulcan, I guess...)

-- Bob
-------------------
Then the horns kicked in...
And my shoes started to squeak.


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