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Subject: "CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Logan_D_alt
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Mar-30-04, 03:54 AM (EST)
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"CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
 
   Well!

That was... different.

Most of the CSI refs escaped me. I don't watch enough TV and I never got into CSI (although I may be spurred into catching an episode now, just to see what the fuss is about).

Some very interesting character moments there. And some good use made of stuff that's only appeared in teh BPGD database articles so far. (Ghost, Neo)

I liked what we got of the assassin's background. Somehow, I get the distinct feeling we'll be seeing more of him. There were some things that were left unexplained (the green glow).

I imagine that this particular set of characters, while entertaining, won't be put to as heavy use as the Symphony set and the main Wedge Rats of old. But that's okay, we got just enough character stuff for it to be interesting.

Oh - and nice bit of mystery and investigative portrayal there. Had me guessing and interested. I'm not a particularly huge fan of the genre so I'll let those more qualified comment on that aspect of it. I'm too dense in that regard to spot any plot holes.

An enjoyable read, people! And you have successfully kept me up an hour and a half past the time I really should have gone to bed! ^_^

-Logan

Legolas - Obviously an Elvish word meaning "gatling gun".


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange CuSO4 Mar-30-04 1
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 5
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Rod_H Mar-30-04 2
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange KoryImran Mar-30-04 3
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 4
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange BluFalcon Mar-31-04 25
             RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Ardaniel Mar-31-04 26
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Mephronmoderator Mar-30-04 6
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Berk Mar-30-04 18
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange BLUE Mar-30-04 19
             RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange EasternExile Apr-04-04 48
                 RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange BLUE Apr-08-04 52
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Adyen Mar-30-04 7
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Mephronmoderator Mar-30-04 8
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 9
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange zojojojo Mar-30-04 10
             RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 13
                 RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange rwpikul Apr-02-04 47
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange StClair Mar-30-04 11
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 12
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Star Ranger4 Mar-30-04 14
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange StClair Mar-30-04 15
             RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 16
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange The Wanderer Mar-30-04 17
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-30-04 20
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange The Wanderer Mar-31-04 28
             RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-31-04 33
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Redneck Mar-30-04 21
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange The Wanderer Mar-31-04 29
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Polychrome Mar-31-04 22
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-31-04 23
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange NeoRavenK7 Mar-31-04 24
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange donnerjackadmin Mar-31-04 27
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Bodhi Mar-31-04 30
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Mephronmoderator Mar-31-04 31
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Mar-31-04 32
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Strife Mar-31-04 34
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange McFortner Mar-31-04 35
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange DrOsborn Apr-01-04 36
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Gryphonadmin Apr-01-04 37
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange PCHammerteam Apr-01-04 38
  CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read trigger Apr-01-04 39
     RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read Gryphonadmin Apr-01-04 40
         RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read trigger Apr-01-04 41
             RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read Gryphonadmin Apr-01-04 42
                 RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read Adyen Apr-01-04 43
                     RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read goldenfire Apr-01-04 44
                 RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read Bad Moon Apr-01-04 45
                     RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read Gryphonadmin Apr-01-04 46
  RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange MoonEyes Apr-04-04 49
     RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange Mephronmoderator Apr-05-04 50
         RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange MoonEyes Apr-08-04 51

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CuSO4
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Mar-30-04, 04:42 AM (EST)
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1. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Nice work!

3 queries:

1. "Raven's my apprentice,"

Appentice in what ? Katsujinkenryuu ?

2. "I understand you've approved Grissom for the Test of Light."

Test of Light needs to be approved by the First Lensman ?

3. "ALSO PRESENT: GRISSOM, Giol'bertis NMI (SA1)"

So Grissom will be relocated to SA1, or he will be working on
both branches ? Correct me if I am worng, to my believe, grey
Lensmen is not in SA1.

--
CuSO4


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Mar-30-04, 10:34 AM (EST)
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5. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #1
 
   >1. "Raven's my apprentice,"
>
>Appentice in what ? Katsujinkenryuu ?

Later.

>2. "I understand you've approved Grissom for the Test of Light."
>
>Test of Light needs to be approved by the First Lensman ?

Generally speaking, yes.

>So Grissom will be relocated to SA1, or he will be working on
>both branches ?

Gris isn't going anywhere. SA1 is as much a clearance level as it is an assignment...

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Rod_H
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Mar-30-04, 05:44 AM (EST)
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2. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Well it's surprising what a near OD of CSI will do, (that's just going by info recieved from other sources).
And thanks to wonders of non-ratings replay I do get most of the CSI refs.

A Skyline R32 being non-descript? Shame on her for not being more car knowledgable, although I suppose the 'worked' versions with the bodykit, paintjobs & wing are more memorable. To me the 'stock' as it stands is still a head turner, and the examples I see sure do what with the large bore mufflers & aftermarket blow-off valves which means you hear 'em before you see 'em.

As to the DVD release...I'm more interested in the impending R4 release of Garibaldi's second favourite thing in the universe.

--Rod.H


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KoryImran
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Mar-30-04, 08:39 AM (EST)
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3. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #2
 
   Congratulations Mephron for making the cast list.


Shawn Earl

When the going gets tough, the tough get going to where it's easier.


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Mar-30-04, 10:33 AM (EST)
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4. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #2
 
   >A Skyline R32 being non-descript? Shame on her for not being more car
>knowledgable,

... you will, I suppose, have to excuse a 25th-century Salusian scientist for not being up on her Japanese performance cars of the late 20th century.

(sheesh.)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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BluFalcon
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Mar-31-04, 02:52 AM (EST)
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25. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #4
 
   LAST EDITED ON 03-31-04 AT 02:53 AM (EST)
 
>>A Skyline R32 being non-descript? Shame on her for not being more car
>>knowledgable,
>
>... you will, I suppose, have to excuse a 25th-century Salusian
>scientist for not being up on her Japanese performance cars of the
>late 20th century.
>
>(sheesh.)
>
>--G.
>-><-
>Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
>Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/

A Skyline R32? Nice. Very nice choice. For some reason the R32 seems to me to be the best looking generation. I just cant get into the looks of the R33 or R34. There's a guy here in Dallas with a metallic grey R32 GT-R, and it's gorgeous. Makes my little old Talon look plain as hell. He asked me to give him a few tips on launching an AWD , and let me ride in the car while he tried it out. Anyway if anyone wants one, MotoRex imports legal Skylines into the U.S. Just don't be too shocked at the prices, excellence doesn't come cheap. http://www.skylinegtr.com/

As far as the story goes, I liked it even though I haven't seen an episode of CSI before. Like you said, a nice change of pace from the usual rayguns and starships going at it all the time.
Ed
Salty Internet Car Geek


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Ardaniel
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Mar-31-04, 03:00 AM (EST)
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26. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #25
 
   WRT all this Skyline stuff...

It's getting offtopic. Nice car, yes. We know. We put it in the story for that reason. Discussion solely of the car, with no reference point to Locard's Exchange, is starting to wander away from the point of the thread.

Ard


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Mephronmoderator
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1763 posts
Mar-30-04, 11:39 AM (EST)
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6. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #2
 
   >A Skyline R32 being non-descript?

Compared to some of the cars out there? Oh, probably. It lacks an external turbocharger, five exhaust pipes, the hover-conversion, then undercarriage lights...

...yeah, the sad thing about a city with a Gernsback Future feel is that sometimes, the stock model cars look like what we of 2004 would call 'all riced-out'.

--
Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
"I find your lack of clue disturbing."


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Berk
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750 posts
Mar-30-04, 06:55 PM (EST)
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18. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #6
 
   Not to forget, for a muscle car.. the Skyline actually has somewhat of an understated look, especially one that's pretty much stock. It doesn't have the Big Sexy Curves of a Viper.. or the painfully nonfunctional air intakes of a Mustang..

It's rather short, kinda wide, and decidedly squared off.

Typical, for a car which Came From The 80s.

Its only real claim to fame is the front grill, which has that rather distinctive 'Slag Eating Grin' look to it. The real fun is all under the hood and in the transmission.

- Berk Watkins
Student of Quantum Bogodynamics


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BLUE
Member since Oct-22-02
394 posts
Mar-30-04, 08:06 PM (EST)
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19. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #6
 
   >>A Skyline R32 being non-descript?
>
>Compared to some of the cars out there? Oh, probably. It lacks an
>external turbocharger, five exhaust pipes, the hover-conversion, then
>undercarriage lights...
>
I suppose that's true, but there's just something about the Skyline, actually, ANY Skyline, that just catches the eye (I got to see a few up close in Japan several years ago, and they are SEXY), and put the GT-R badge on there and it just gets better. I suppose that the initials "GT" have long since been replaced by something else, but one would think that a CSI would know that anything badged with "GT" is something out of the ordinary.

On a side note, is Geoff the first real person in UF to start out as a genuine criminal? What's-his-name (excuse me for being to lazy to look up the name tonight), who created Largo, was criminally stupid, but that's something else. Anyone else start out as an honest-to-badness bad guy?

-D-

"I don't tell you how to remove bullets. Don't you tell me how to make killing machines back into little girls." Captain Kaff Tagon of Tagon's Toughs, Schlock Mercenary


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EasternExile
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Apr-04-04, 00:20 AM (EST)
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48. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #19
 
   Strong Bad has yet to appear yet...
>else start out as an honest-to-badness bad guy?


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BLUE
Member since Oct-22-02
394 posts
Apr-08-04, 06:08 PM (EST)
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52. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #48
 
   >Strong Bad has yet to appear yet...
>>else start out as an honest-to-badness bad guy?

Uh, Strong Bad isn't a real person.

Gryphon, Zoner, Truss, and the rest of the WPI people started off as good guys, Redneck and Doc Mui and Marty Rose all did as well. Anne Cross was a fugitive, but from the Psi-Corps, so that doesn't really count. Jedi Anne definately is a good guy. Janice is as well. Geoff is the only real person I can think of who wasn't on the side of right, and is a criminal by the standards of Gryphon (or at least, by the standards of law that Gryphon established) and all the rest, as well, on his introduction.

-D-

"I don't tell you how to remove bullets. Don't you tell me how to make killing machines back into little girls." Captain Kaff Tagon of Tagon's Toughs, Schlock Mercenary


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Adyen
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Mar-30-04, 12:07 PM (EST)
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7. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Yay! CSI! My brother's a fan of it. Too bad I'm not that big of one. heh.

> The Black Hood turned to look at his detachment's Q-Boss.
"He's already carved his way through half our men, and he just keeps
coming! Rooftop sniper had a clean headshot and he -got out of the
way-! He's not HUMAN!"

*cough* There are like, hundreds of different races out there, and the saying still remains. heh.

Q-Boss stared. "Trained? What are you talking about? No one
walks away from Big Fire! Allegiance or death!"
The man with the guns looked into Q-Boss's eyes.
"I know. That's why blew my handler's head off."

Typo?

Sara put the book down on her desk and turned in her chair
just as a man came into view through the glass wall of the bullpen.
She didn't recognize him. He was about her height (not awfully tall
for a human male) and had a stocky build, shortish brown hair, a
close-trimmed beard, and glasses. He was wearing a beat-up old green
Army jacket, jeans, and well-worn boots, and generally didn't look
like the sort of person who ought to be prowling around the crime lab
on an off day.

Wow! She doesn't know the Gryphon? I thought everyone in New Avalon would know him from one place or another... (He certainly knew all the ambassadors on B6!)

Whatever it was, he handled it with authority, and he knew the
streets and alleys of New Avalon like Sara knew the back of her hand.
She spent a lot of the ride looking out the windows, trying to lock
onto a landmark and figure out where she was, but the effort proved
futile until they suddenly popped out of a side street and into a
pleasant square with a tree in the middle.

Didn't he design New Avalon? lol

Gryphon smiled, guided the car into an angled parking slot
along one side of the square, and shut it down. "Well," he said, "I
don't want to seem smug or anything, but I -did- lay out the city."

Yes he did. :P

Gryphon thumbed a button on the car's ignition key, causing
the doors to lock with a satisfyingly solid 'chunk' sound and the horn
to pip once. Then he turned a friendly grin to Sara, angled a thumb
over his shoulder, and said,
"You like ice cream?"

He picked this up from Skuld, didn't he? Probably designed this place to have ice cream just for her too!

"Oh, it's you," Brass replied, shaking the offered hand but
affecting to look unimpressed. "I didn't recognize you in your
homeless-vet camouflage," he added, gesturing to the jacket.

Ahhhhhhh... Enlightenment. Or something like that.

You know how many crims have left the night shift in the last
five years? -None-. You -know- how remarkable that is,

What's 'crims'?

Greg grinned. "All part of the service," he said. "Oh, and I
see Gris got you... a cactus. Sweet. Must be as close as he can get
to apologizing for the nightmare assignment. Either that or he's
trying to tell you that he thinks you're pretty, but prickly."
"Actually, Greg, the Christmas cactus is not a true cactus,"
said Grissom's didactic voice from right behind the Dantrovian lab
tech, making him wince.

Ahhh... That's sooooooo Grissom. Now, if he'd explain how it's different...

"Are you implying that we should misappropriate company
resources for personal use?" Gryphon inquired.
"Yes," Sara replied.
Gryphon grinned.
"I like the sound of that," he said just before the stairway
door closed behind them, leaving the rooftop empty.

*snort* Neposism. lol

Overall, a good story. Didn't see some people's backgrounds, but once they're in, I supposed they'll appear again someday, right?


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Mephronmoderator
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Mar-30-04, 12:10 PM (EST)
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8. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #7
 
   >You know how many crims have left the night shift in the last
>five years? -None-. You -know- how remarkable that is,

>
>What's 'crims'?

Criminologists.

--
Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
"I find your lack of clue disturbing."


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Mar-30-04, 01:23 PM (EST)
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9. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #7
 
   >"He's not HUMAN!"
>
>*cough* There are like, hundreds of different races out there, and the
>saying still remains. heh.

An effort was made, around the 2380s, to popularize a Salusian loan-word so that the Standard language would have a word meaning all the things we mean when we say we're "only human" without the single-race connotation, but it didn't stick. If you say that kind of thing in the 25th century, people generally understand what you mean, unless they interpret it specifically for irony's sake (as in racially charged political rhetoric).

>Wow! She doesn't know the Gryphon?

Not yet. :)

>He picked this up from Skuld, didn't he? Probably designed this place
>to have ice cream just for her too!

No, indeed, G was a fan of ice cream long before he met Skuld. And although he did design New Avalon's layout, that doesn't mean he personally chose the location of every business that decided to open its doors in the city; Tosci's has a branch in Salutown because it's a popular Salusian ice cream chain. (There are also branches in Claremont and Westmont.)

>You know how many crims have left the night shift in the last
>five years? -None-. You -know- how remarkable that is,

>
>What's 'crims'?

Short for "criminalist", which is one of the terms by which crime scene investigators know themselves. Geoff's a little off in his post - a criminologist is a scientist who studies criminal behavior and the overall idea of crime as a social phenomenon. A criminalist is someone who specializes in the collection and analysis of physical evidence. Criminalists can also be criminologists - Grissom is, for instance, as per the first season finale, Strip Strangler - but they aren't necessarily.

>"Are you implying that we should misappropriate company
>resources for personal use?" Gryphon inquired.
> "Yes," Sara replied.
> Gryphon grinned.
> "I like the sound of that," he said just before the stairway
>door closed behind them, leaving the rooftop empty.

>
>*snort* Neposism. lol

Nah, that's not nepotism. Nepotism would be if he promoted her or gave her a raise or some such career-advancing thing just because he likes her. (Actually, according to the strict definition of nepotism, she'd have to be related to him. Showing that kind of favor to non-relatives is just patronage or favoritism.) Technically speaking, using the Stargate network to go on a date is embezzlement.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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zojojojo
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610 posts
Mar-30-04, 02:16 PM (EST)
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10. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #9
 
   >Technically
>speaking, using the Stargate network to go on a date is embezzlement.

Isn't it all his money, anyway? I mean, he pretty much IS the government, and his personal fortune is funding (or at least started up) the IPO and (I'm guessing) New Avalon itself... Wouldn't that just make it an extremely expensive date? :)


-Z

Rabid Crack Turtle 3.14159
---
If G-d had wanted us to think for ourselves, He'd have given us brains.


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Mar-30-04, 02:31 PM (EST)
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13. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #10
 
   >>Technically
>>speaking, using the Stargate network to go on a date is embezzlement.
>
>Isn't it all his money, anyway?

More or less, yeah, which is why he doesn't get any particular integrity-related heartburn over it. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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rwpikul
Member since Jun-22-03
177 posts
Apr-02-04, 00:05 AM (EST)
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47. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #13
 
   >>>Technically
>>>speaking, using the Stargate network to go on a date is embezzlement.
>>
>>Isn't it all his money, anyway?
>
>More or less, yeah, which is why he doesn't get any particular
>integrity-related heartburn over it. :)

Somehow, I also think he has the same attitude that the Canadian Air Force has towards the misuse of its aircraft:

Did you break it or waste supplies? Did you endanger anyone? Did you get us a load of civillian complaints?

No?

Ok then, just make sure you get home _before_ your wife finds out that you barrel rolled a 707 again.

--
Chakat Firepaw - Inventor & Scientist (Mad)


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StClair
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698 posts
Mar-30-04, 02:20 PM (EST)
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11. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Bah. You call this CSI? Where are the role-playing exercises at the crime scene? The quasi-pornographic shots burrowing deep into (simulated) human tissue?

(Just kidding, boss.)


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Gryphonadmin
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Mar-30-04, 02:28 PM (EST)
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12. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #11
 
   >Bah. You call this CSI? Where are the role-playing exercises at the
>crime scene? The quasi-pornographic shots burrowing deep into
>(simulated) human tissue?
>
>(Just kidding, boss.)

To paraphrase a World War II-era U.S. propaganda campaign, was this post really necessary?

(Anyway, do you have any idea what a hassle it would be to describe one of those bullet-cam scenes in text?)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Star Ranger4
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14. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #12
 
   >(Anyway, do you have any idea what a hassle it would be to describe
>one of those bullet-cam scenes in text?)
>

Actually, I rather do have a good idea. That would definatly be the case where a picture is worth MORE than a thousand words.

Besides, why should G bother? My minds eye did all the bullet cam scenes for him without him having to type a word.


Of COURSE you wernt expecting it!
No One expects the FANNISH INQUISITION!
RCW# 86


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StClair
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15. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #12
 
   I wasn't aware that bandwidth was being rationed. Teach me to miss staff meetings...

Actually, I think it's a fine story. (A high point for me was Sara's refreshingly "normal" post-reaction to having a gun in her face; another was your use of Luthor's observation in another context, making it sound a bit less malevolent.) And you captured the tone of the show, and the interaction of its characters, very well; I just felt like goofing on some of its tropes, including one that I knew wouldn't translate well to text.

(At least I didn't ask about the opening aerial shot of New Avalon. ;) )


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Gryphonadmin
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16. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #15
 
   LAST EDITED ON 03-30-04 AT 03:39 PM (EST)
 
>another was your use of Luthor's observation in another context,
>making it sound a bit less malevolent.

... a bit?

>(At least I didn't ask about the opening aerial shot of New Avalon. ;)

Heh. Well, you know, every episode has one of those, usually shot from the Frost Enterprises zeppelin. I figured it went without saying. (This particular one has the mother of all "zoom out to the suburbs after showing the Strip" effects, too. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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The Wanderer
Member since Jun-18-14
1 posts
Mar-30-04, 06:00 PM (EST)
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17. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Excellent story; possibly my favourite UF piece in some while, even without being a fan of the source show (I'm not sure I've ever watched it). One question:

        The Original Toscanini's wasn't terribly busy.  There were
only three other people in the place, besides the staff, when Gryphon
and Sara walked in. The jukebox in the corner was playing Johnny
Cash's "Ring of Fire", which struck Gryphon as a mildly peculiar
selection for an ice cream parlor.

Should this be considered part of the soundtrack for this story, and hence included in my soundtrack listing, or is it just background noise?

--
The Wanderer


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Gryphonadmin
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20. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #17
 
   >Should this be considered part of the soundtrack for this story, and
>hence included in my soundtrack listing, or is it just background
>noise?

I...

... you're gonna have to make your own decision there.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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The Wanderer
Member since Jun-18-14
1 posts
Mar-31-04, 07:34 AM (EST)
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28. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #20
 
   >>Should this be considered part of the soundtrack for this story, and
>>hence included in my soundtrack listing, or is it just background
>>noise?
>
>I...
>
>... you're gonna have to make your own decision there.

I knew I should have disclaimed this more.

<shrug> Very well, I won't list it. I just wondered if this was an intentional way of #include-ing the song without an explicit outside-the-narrative music reference; if it was, you'd know, so it doesn't get counted.


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Gryphonadmin
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Mar-31-04, 02:32 PM (EST)
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33. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #28
 
   ><shrug> Very well, I won't list it. I just wondered if this was an
>intentional way of #include-ing the song without an explicit
>outside-the-narrative music reference; if it was, you'd know, so it
>doesn't get counted.

Oh oh, I get it now. What you're asking is, "Are Gryphon and Sara aware that love is a burning thing, and it makes a fiery ring?" To which the answer is, "Well, Sara isn't generally aware of much of anything that doesn't directly relate to work, but Gryphon's been known to harbor suspicions in that direction from time to time in his life."

There. Hope that clears things up for you.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Redneck
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Mar-30-04, 10:10 PM (EST)
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21. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #17
 
   >Should this be considered part of the soundtrack for this story, and
>hence included in my soundtrack listing, or is it just background
>noise?

I recommend you look up the term, "source music," sometime.

Redneck

Kris Overstreet, aka Redneck Gaijin
http://www.wlpcomics.com/redneck/
White Lightning Productions - huge tracts of land for sale
http://www.wlpcomics.com

"And what's the big emotional deal about being called a planet or not? Are we afraid of hurting Pluto's feelings? Is there an advantageous tax bracket if you're a planet?" - John Martin, aka LJ "fwootamala"


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The Wanderer
Member since Jun-18-14
1 posts
Mar-31-04, 07:34 AM (EST)
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29. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #21
 
   >>Should this be considered part of the soundtrack for this story, and
>>hence included in my soundtrack listing, or is it just background
>>noise?
>
>I recommend you look up the term, "source music," sometime.

Where? Googling turns up nothing, and I don't have a phrase dictionary anywhere handy.

Or am I being overy literal?


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Polychrome
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Mar-31-04, 00:08 AM (EST)
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22. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   >I liked what we got of the assassin's background. Somehow, I get the
>distinct feeling we'll be seeing more of him. There were some things
>that were left unexplained (the green glow).

Actually, I think I have an answer for that one. At the very end of the credits there is a Bungie mention.
In the Bungie game Oni the main character, Konoko, has been bonded to a symbiote that gives her regeneration,
resistance to poisons and a combat boost that is accompanied by a purple glow. These are similiar to the
abilities Geoff displays and we know he was experimented on. It would also explain the additional DNA in his blood.
Of course I could just be talking out my ass, nad the Bungie ref is something else I completely failed to pick up on.

Polychrome


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Gryphonadmin
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23. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #22
 
   >Actually, I think I have an answer for that one.

Winnah!

Polychrome gets 5 points.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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NeoRavenK7
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24. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Damn!
If only I didn't have to get up at 5 am to go to work!

-NeoRaven
McD's is eeeevvvviiiillll....


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donnerjackadmin
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Mar-31-04, 03:03 AM (EST)
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27. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON 03-31-04 AT 03:10 AM (EST) by Gryphon (admin)
 
[Just fixing your markup for you... --G.]

Alright, just to get the obvious out of the way, I'll say up front, that was good stuff, and I liked it a lot. Hardly a surprise, since there's very, very little that's been written by EPU that I didn't think was good and didn't like a lot. On to the particulars.

One of the reasons I've been really enjoying a lot of these semi-tangental stories is the fact that we get a nice look at some characters we haven't seen before, who aren't caught up in the overall arc of the UF:FI plotline, and some interactions with characters who we do know well that can be new and surprising. Sara's a great character, though I've no idea how close to the source material her character is, and it's fun to see her getting involved with people like Gryphon and the rest of the IPO higher ups. The rest of the CSI crew that we get to see is, well, a pretty classic IPO group of people, so they're interesting, likeable, and fun to watch, but Sara and Gris are probably the characters that are most interesting as characters within the story overall.

Meph's introduction is...wow. The fact that the source of his powers is borrowed from Oni is giving me some serious cognitive dissonance, since he's not a hot girl with purple hair, but it makes perfect sense. His introduction is strange for a UF character, though, in retrospect, it doesn't really strike me as all that odd for him to have a backstory like that. I'm going to be very interested in seeing what his "sentence" for his crimes ends up being, and I'll be very much looking forward to more of him later.

Ah, the Ignatine clerics. I loved the BPGD entry on these guys, and I'm seriously digging on the integration of their source material and the Matrix source material in UF, since the two have a striking amount in common. Melding them together must be an interesting experience for you guys, and I'm expecting it to be a very satisfying thing to read. I liked the source material for them (Equilibrium for those who haven't seen it) a lot more than I expected to, just as a fun kind of thing, and I think they have some serious potential to be very cool characters in UF.

That pretty much covers the high points, liked it lots, and looking forward to seeing more of the CSI crew. An excellent job, as always.

Donnerjack
---
reality@peoplearestrange.net
BOFH of www.astralstudios.com


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Bodhi
Member since Jan-19-09
24 posts
Mar-31-04, 11:16 AM (EST)
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30. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #27
 
  
>One of the reasons I've been really enjoying a lot of these
>semi-tangental stories is the fact that we get a nice look at some
>characters we haven't seen before, who aren't caught up in the overall
>arc of the UF:FI plotline, and some interactions with characters who
>we do know well that can be new and surprising. Sara's a great
>character, though I've no idea how close to the source material her
>character is, and it's fun to see her getting involved with people
>like Gryphon and the rest of the IPO higher ups. The rest of the CSI
>crew that we get to see is, well, a pretty classic IPO group of
>people, so they're interesting, likeable, and fun to watch, but Sara
>and Gris are probably the characters that are most interesting as
>characters within the story overall.

I agree, Sara and Gris are nice additions. The interactions between them, as well as, individually with UF-Gryph come off very nice.

And Catherine... It's good to be King, you get to meet all the pretty girls.

>Meph's introduction is...wow.

Yep, makes me wish the story was longer. Not that I'm complaining. But Meph could be a force for great chaos within the ranks of the bad guys

>Ah, the Ignatine clerics. I loved the BPGD entry on these guys, and
>I'm seriously digging on the integration of their source material and
>the Matrix source material in UF, since the two have a striking amount
>in common. Melding them together must be an interesting experience
>for you guys, and I'm expecting it to be a very satisfying thing to
>read. I liked the source material for them (Equilibrium for
>those who haven't seen it) a lot more than I expected to, just as a
>fun kind of thing, and I think they have some serious potential to be
>very cool characters in UF.

Especially if Utena and Kate get the chance to train with and/or talk with Neo or Ghost. Force assisted Gun-kata or Ignatine kenjitsu? Hmm...

It would be nice to see more of the Clerics, in any circumstance.

EPU always does a great job and this was no exception.

-- Bodhi


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Mephronmoderator
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Mar-31-04, 12:50 PM (EST)
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31. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #30
 
   >>Meph's introduction is...wow.
>
>Yep, makes me wish the story was longer. Not that I'm complaining.
>But Meph could be a force for great chaos within the ranks of the bad
>guys.

This was, really, more of a CSI story. I think it worked well - it hung together like an episode would, and dealt with the subject the way they would deal with it on the show.

Now, maybe there will be a spinoff series, maybe not, but as the saying goes, only time will tell.

--
Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
"I find your lack of clue disturbing."


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Gryphonadmin
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Mar-31-04, 02:14 PM (EST)
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32. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #30
 
   >And Catherine... It's good to be King, you get to meet all the pretty
>girls.

One thing I designed for this piece and then didn't end up having a good place to use was a sequence in which Warrick and Nick were overcome by their curiosity and asked Cath where she knows the Chief from. I'll have to work it into the next one someplace, though by the time that's done I may have posted a database file which makes the answer obvious. :)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Strife
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Mar-31-04, 09:12 PM (EST)
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34. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Just sneaking my comments in here...

As a fan(atic) of the source material, I must say that, to me, you've nailed the personalities of the CSI crew perfectly. It felt as if I was watching an episode of CSI, except for seeing Sara and Gil as humanized Salusians...

Lessee, lessee....

-Making Greg a Dantrovian was a bloody brilliant play with his character.
-I _so_ dearly would love to see how you translated Cath's backstory for UF
-Can't wait to see more of this crew..

~Strife Aileron
Who's wondering if Eddie's still kicking around.... (NO, I'm not asking/demanding if he is, I'm just idly wondering...)


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McFortner
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Mar-31-04, 10:09 PM (EST)
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35. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Well, what can I say but good story. Never seen CSI either. Oh, well. I hear too much about it working at 911...

BTW, loved the Dragnet reference. I first saw that eppisode a long time ago as a little tyke. Had me wondering if Friday and Gannon were going to make an appearance....

Michael



Michael C. Fortner
RCW #2(n+1)

Americans do not surrender.
- Gen. George S. Patton, Jr.



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DrOsborn
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Apr-01-04, 08:53 AM (EST)
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36. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   Good story overall.

>Locard's Exchange

I'm clueless on this reference.

>Chief Inspector Jim Brass of the New Avalon Police gave
>him a wry look. "I'm in Homicide," he said sardonically.
>"I don't run plates."
>"Oh, it's you," Brass replied

Perfect charaterization of Brass.

>"The near miss lifted up the shelf, the bullet rode along
>underneath it, and then the shelf fell back down to cover
>the hole. I saw that on an old TV show one time." Catherine
>turned her grin to him. "I saw the same show. That's what
>made me think of it."

I saw the same show, but I can't remember what it was!

Greg Sanders as a Dantrovian. Perfect species casting.

>The Chief wants us to kick out all the stops for this
>one, so we'll be using the Stargate network...

I thought the Stargates were top secret. Now it sound
like every planet has one and any official person can use
them. Are then still under strict IPO control?

>Grissom smiled. "Ragol is an entomologist's paradise,"

This cracked me up.

>What I just handed him is his -sentence-."

So what IS his sentence? Nightcrawlers an Expert of
Justice, so is he now doing the same thing as before
but with official sanction?

Credits:
>especially the writers of "Superman: Last Son of Krypton"

Is this a reference to a comic or graphic novel or a
reference to the text novel that came out in the late
70's after the origianl Superman movie?

CSI UF - a fun concept. DrOsborn


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Gryphonadmin
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Apr-01-04, 11:32 AM (EST)
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37. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #36
 
   >>Locard's Exchange
>
>I'm clueless on this reference.

(And, you know, far be it from anyone to look anything up for himself around here... )

Dr. Edmond Locard (1877-1966), student of Alphonse Bertillon (inventor of fingerprinting) and founder of the world's first dedicated forensic investigation laboratory, said:

“Toute action de l'homme, et a fortiori, l'action violente qu'est un crime, ne peut pas se dérouler sans laisser quelque marque.” (Any action of an individual, and obviously, the violent action constituting a crime, cannot occur without leaving a trace.)

This is known among criminalists as Locard's Exchange Principle, and is one of the cornerstones of modern forensic investigation.

>>"The near miss lifted up the shelf, the bullet rode along
>>underneath it, and then the shelf fell back down to cover
>>the hole. I saw that on an old TV show one time." Catherine
>>turned her grin to him. "I saw the same show. That's what
>>made me think of it."
>
>I saw the same show, but I can't remember what it was!

Someone else here pegged it earlier - it's from an episode of the 1966 color version of Jack Webb's classic cop show, Dragnet. In it, Joe Friday's bacon is saved from an officer-involved-shooting review board by a crime scene tech who goes back to the scene of the incident and finds what had previously eluded him and his team: The bullet the suspect fired at Friday. (Before then, since they couldn't find the bad guy's gun either, it had looked to the review board like Friday had panicked and shot an unarmed suspect.)

Avalon 17 shows Dragnet at 3 AM. Cath used to watch it when she got home from work, back when she had a different job and her shift ended at 2. :)

>>The Chief wants us to kick out all the stops for this
>>one, so we'll be using the Stargate network...
>
>I thought the Stargates were top secret. Now it sound
>like every planet has one and any official person can use
>them. Are then still under strict IPO control?

Yes they are - Grissom's lab is part of the IPO, remember. The gate on Zardon is in a slightly different situation than most, because the Justice Department wasn't about to let a foreign police agency establish an independent headquarters on their planet without oversight, so the IPO enclave on Zardon is in the Hall of Justice itself; but such close cooperation exists between those two agencies that Gryphon felt comfortable making the exception and permitting the Zardons to know about the gates.

Sara's experience in Records notwithstanding, the Justice Department works very closely with the IPO on most matters - the Judges take it as a point of pride that they're held up as some of the best law enforcers in the galaxy, able to work on an even footing with the Experts of Justice. This is true to such an extent that, as we shall see in the next CSI: New Avalon episode, there's a Judge permanently attached to Special Assignment 1. He's the only active Judge serving outside Zardon sovereign territory.

>>What I just handed him is his -sentence-."
>
>So what IS his sentence?

When your favorite television show leaves an obvious hook for some later development, do you call up the producers and ask them what it is?

>Credits:
>>especially the writers of "Superman: Last Son of Krypton"
>
>Is this a reference to a comic or graphic novel or a
>reference to the text novel that came out in the late
>70's after the origianl Superman movie?

Neither. Pilot movie to the mid-1990s animated series. Gryphon cribbed one of Lex Luthor's best lines.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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PCHammerteam
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Apr-01-04, 11:41 AM (EST)
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38. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #36
 
   >>Grissom smiled. "Ragol is an entomologist's paradise,"

Provided your idea of a "paradise" includes being eaten by your study subjects. :)

>Credits:
>>especially the writers of "Superman: Last Son of Krypton"
>
>Is this a reference to a comic or graphic novel or a
>reference to the text novel that came out in the late
>70's after the origianl Superman movie?

The WB animated series, actually. "Last Son of Krypton" was the three-part premiere - next time you sit down to watch it, listen a little more closely as Lex explains his relationship to Metropolis near the end.

- Lord Ilmartello!
"Another temblor?" "No. The last one."


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trigger
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Apr-01-04, 12:54 PM (EST)
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39. "CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #0
 
  
I liked it a lot (read it a couple days ago when it first came out, but like has slammed me so hard, I haven't been able to post). I re-read for the second time last night.

- Not your best writing, but true to the scripting of CSI (love the LV much more than Miami).

- This might be first true SI I've seen y'all write. Usually you don't write yourselves into the source material without altering the source material alot more. Any particular reason?

- Greg was inspired

- I'm sorry to see that Nick and Warick (with the exceptions of the gambling reference and the dig at Nick's competition with Sara) were kinda one dimentional. They're like that on the show too, and while I appreciate their eye candy qualities, I'm a little disappointed y'all didn't expand on them - or give them another case to work.

- Nice job with Sara; she seems a lot less bitter than her TV counterpart which make me more sympathetic to her. Still, i don't see what Gryph sees in her.

- Catherine was great but kinda wierd - a lot more perky but still with all the nice sharp edges; I kept looking for the simmering resentment (and repartee with Grissom) that is so part of her TV avatar. Ah well, to each their own. I look forward to the backstory since it sounds like she was a around at the creation of New Avalon, which must have been something to see.

- Brass was sweet, and the dig at the New Avalon county sherif - <i>parfait</i>

- I found Depew...well, boring? He was kinda cool in the begining, but the confession thing at the end (very CSI btw) was just, well, too easy. Yeah, the guy totally needed to vent, but he didn't have very much personality (sorry dude!) and if Gil Grissom wasn't disecting him, I wouldn't have really cared. Actually, not that I think about during my re-reads I skipped his confession. Hmm.

- Also was that bit inspired by Cowboy Bebop?

- Great focus on New Avalon (A city that doesn't get enough love). Good tie ins with our existing knowledge of the city, esp. the neighborhoods. Ditto with Big Fire. I'll point out a possible mistake Gyph and team made by aprehending Depew - he hadn't made it all the way to Agent A, and wouldn't it make sense to use whatever this guy has to find her?

- I'll also note that the IPO's authority in the sphere was remarkably unhampered by the local cops. I know Gryph owns the place, but law enforcement agencies have been tradionally rivals, and given the sherif...well, I was a little disappointed by the lack of that back story, but hey, it was pretty awesome, so I shouldn't complain.

Last and not least - Gil Grissom, warrior? What gives?!

it was fun,
t.

Trigger Argee
trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"And I will see to it that your PLASMA-BLEACHED BONES
decoratethehalloftheVANQUISHED, you WORRRRRM! There they shall serve
as a perpetual reminder to FUTURE GENERATIONS of the FOLLY of contending
against the IRKEN ELITE - epecially your HIDEOUSLY MALPROPORTIONED
SKULL!" - Zim, having a little fun


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Gryphonadmin
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Apr-01-04, 01:20 PM (EST)
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40. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #39
 
   > - This might be first true SI I've seen y'all write. Usually you
>don't write yourselves into the source material without altering the
>source material alot more. Any particular reason?

It's kind of old-school, isn't it? It's kind of an experiment. Actually, it's kind of several experiments, both inside and outside the story. Outside, it's me playing with a tighter focus and lower power level within the UF universe. Inside, it's (in part) Gryphon trying to sort himself out, a process that began with his retreat to Ishiyama (which I haven't shown yet) and continuing in this story after his return to New Avalon.

> - I'm sorry to see that Nick and Warick (with the exceptions of the
>gambling reference and the dig at Nick's competition with Sara) were
>kinda one dimentional.

Well, you know, it's kind of like the show - not everybody gets major screen time every episode. (I watched an episode the other day that didn't even have Sara in it, not once, which ought to be against the law, but I digress.) I like Warrick a lot, and I like what little of Nick we get to see, but I agree they didn't get much of a chance to shine in Locard's Exchange. Hopefully I'll be able to remedy that in the future.

> - Nice job with Sara; she seems a lot less bitter than her TV
>counterpart which make me more sympathetic to her. Still, i don't see
>what Gryph sees in her.

Neither does Sara, really, which gives them an interesting dynamic. :)

> - Catherine was great but kinda wierd - a lot more perky but still
>with all the nice sharp edges; I kept looking for the simmering
>resentment (and repartee with Grissom) that is so part of her TV
>avatar.

... Well. I guess it's true what they say about each person's interpretation of the world being the only reality. I don't get simmering resentment from Cath on TV. Oh, sure, she gets annoyed now and then when she gets some bullshit assignment like having to go way the hell out to East Asshole, NV to look into the shooting of a convenience store clerk,but for the most part I generally get the impression she's pretty happy with life.

Then again, I haven't watched my season 3 box set yet. Maybe that's a more recent development.

> Yeah, the guy totally needed to vent, but he didn't have very
>much personality (sorry dude!) and if Gil Grissom wasn't disecting
>him, I wouldn't have really cared.

Well, to be fair, he's not supposed to have much personality; he's a programmed assassin who's trying to become a person, but doesn't really know how to go about it, so in terms of interpersonal dynamic he's little better than an asocial android at this point. There's not a lot we could do about that.

We have development planned for him, but it probably won't happen in this subseries.

>I'll point out a possible
>mistake Gyph and team made by aprehending Depew - he hadn't made it
>all the way to Agent A, and wouldn't it make sense to use whatever
>this guy has to find her?

And just let him keep busting down doors and slaughtering people until he got there? Maybe that kind of law enforcement strategy flies on Zardon, but in New Avalon we tend to try and stop killing sprees, no matter who's getting killed.

> - I'll also note that the IPO's authority in the sphere was
>remarkably unhampered by the local cops. I know Gryph owns the place,
>but law enforcement agencies have been tradionally rivals, and given
>the sherif...

We didn't get to see Sheriff Mobley because his turf is basically the pseudocontinent outside the city, and the crimes in Locard's Exchange all either happened in the city or on some other planet. The IPO and the New Avalon Police work together much more closely than the IPO and the sheriff's department (witness Chief Inspector Brass's cooperation with Grissom and his crew), but there wasn't an angle to show that from in this story.

>Last and not least - Gil Grissom, warrior? What gives?!

Heh. Sara noticed that too, but wasn't really in a position to follow it up. It might not've been what Gris was trying to imply with his wording, but it sure sounded like it to her.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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trigger
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1500 posts
Apr-01-04, 02:30 PM (EST)
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41. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #40
 
   > Outside, it's me playing with a tighter focus and lower
>power level within the UF universe.

Hmm. I see what you're saying. UF isn't episodic is it? Not even NXE held to typical tv episode constraints. CSI was very different, and a a lot of action occurred off screen with the players telling us about, rather than showing us.

Likewise, we've been reading (with joy) more about the superpowered SOS crew then average joes. Is this an off shoot of the red vs. blue crew (normal people-- ok, more normal people with cool toys) that showed up in the most recent SOS story, or are you feeling inspired again to try something new? What ever it is...I think I could learn to like it. The style is very sparse yet it doesn't skimp on plot, main character development, arc, and all those things we've come to know and love in good lit. Plus it appears to have cut down significantly on the fiddly detail questions.

I look forward to seeing more of this type of experiment.


>Inside, it's (in part)
>Gryphon trying to sort himself out, a process that began with his
>retreat to Ishiyama (which I haven't shown yet) and continuing in this
>story after his return to New Avalon.

Now that is something I've been looking forward to since we learned Kori was heading to Ishiyama and that poster came out. Neat: Gryphon character development! That hasn't happened (really) since, what, Twilight? No, more like Out of the Cold. Makes sense - it's only been 20 or so years since then.


>... Well. I guess it's true what they say about each person's
>interpretation of the world being the only reality.

Ok, I admit bias - I like Catherine more than Sara, and feel that any episode not featuring her is a loss. I'll also admit I'm in the minority who thinks the Grissom/Sara tension is annoying. <grin> I'll try to keep that from influencing my opinion of UF CSI.


>Then again, I haven't watched my season 3 box set yet. Maybe that's a
>more recent development.

It might be. I watched season 3 fanatically, rented season 1, and seen a couple season 2 re-reruns...so, my CSI opinions are greatly influenced by everything shown in 2003. Or I could just be wrong (see above).


>Well, to be fair, he's not supposed to have much personality;
>he's a programmed assassin who's trying to become a person, but
>doesn't really know how to go about it, so in terms of interpersonal
>dynamic he's little better than an asocial android at this point.
>There's not a lot we could do about that.

Oh. I didn't think of him as a programmed assassin a la Femme Nikita on steroids and symbiotes. The opening reminded me of the Punisher(which I admit isn't very accurate) and a couple scenes from Cowboy Bebop. It all make sense now...


>We have development planned for him, but it probably won't happen in
>this subseries.

Nifty.


>And just let him keep busting down doors and slaughtering people until
>he got there? Maybe that kind of law enforcement strategy flies on
>Zardon, but in New Avalon we tend to try and stop killing
>sprees, no matter who's getting killed.

Nice...was that a quote for the Comet?


>The IPO and the New Avalon Police work together much more closely than
>the IPO and the sheriff's department (witness Chief Inspector Brass's
>cooperation with Grissom and his crew), but there wasn't an angle to
>show that from in this story.

Ah, missed that. Thought Brass was IPO.


>Heh. Sara noticed that too, but wasn't really in a position to follow
>it up. It might not've been what Gris was trying to imply with his
>wording, but it sure sounded like it to her.

Talk about enigmatic wording...


*sigh*
t.

Trigger Argee
trigger_argee@hotmail.com
Manon, Maccadon, Orado, etc.
Denton, never leave home without it.

"And I will see to it that your PLASMA-BLEACHED BONES
decoratethehalloftheVANQUISHED, you WORRRRRM! There they shall serve
as a perpetual reminder to FUTURE GENERATIONS of the FOLLY of contending
against the IRKEN ELITE - epecially your HIDEOUSLY MALPROPORTIONED
SKULL!" - Zim, having a little fun


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Apr-01-04, 04:32 PM (EST)
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42. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #41
 
   >Is this an off shoot of the red vs. blue
>crew (normal people-- ok, more normal people with cool toys) that
>showed up in the most recent SOS story, or are you feeling inspired
>again to try something new?

Separate developments. The Repo Men and McCandless's people are basically setup for future developments, and they're operating within a pretty standard Symphony space-action story (though after I'm done with it, I'm going to try and move the Symphony away from space action and back to something closer to its roots for Symphony No. 5).

>>Inside, it's (in part)
>>Gryphon trying to sort himself out, a process that began with his
>>retreat to Ishiyama (which I haven't shown yet) and continuing in this
>>story after his return to New Avalon.
>
>Now that is something I've been looking forward to since we learned
>Kori was heading to Ishiyama and that poster came out. Neat: Gryphon
>character development!

It's been interesting playing around with him. For his Symphony appearances he was more or less inevitably pushed into the usual role that the parents in stories that star teenagers end up in - benevolent, competent, not on camera much. He had a few nice moments here and there (I've always been fond of the way his own relationship to Utena developed), but for the most part, in the Symphony, he's more prop than character.

Well, I've recently received a memo informing me that he's not content to fade into that role on a permanent basis, so, I'm trying something new with him, and his part in Locard's Exchange was one of the opening moves.

I don't want to go into it too deeply here, because I'd rather develop it on screen, but basically, he's spent the last 30 years - since he was cleared of the murder charges in 2380 - on a one-man crusade to save the galaxy, first with the rebuilding of the WDF, then with the establishment of the IPO, and subsequently the IP Space Force. He's had a lot of help, don't get me wrong, but he's been the go-to guy for all these efforts (with the notable exception of Babylon, which Zoner handled), and he's been raising a family and catching up with friends and everything else... he's been trying to be all things to all people, running faster and faster, pushing harder and harder.

Even a man like him can't keep that kind of thing up forever, and Kei's disappearance destroyed his momentum. At first he thought he'd go away for a while, regain his strength, and then jump back in and pick up where he left off, but he's come to the conclusion that he just can't do that any more. It's time to sit down, delegate, and make the focus of his own efforts smaller. He's put a lot of time and effort into gathering good people to work for him, and he's not doing them any favors either by trying to do it all himself.

One of the hoped-for effects of this slowdown is the creation of actual free time, which he hasn't really had in... well, years.

So that's kind of where he's coming from when he takes an amble through the tenth-floor crime lab on a quiet holiday morning and randomly invites a criminalist out for ice cream. :)

>I'll also admit I'm in the
>minority who thinks the Grissom/Sara tension is annoying.

Heh. I stumbled across a website focusing on that aspect of the fandom the other day, and I have to confess I was moderately baffled by it. Again, it must be an artifact of the half of the show's run I haven't seen yet; either that, or these people are reading a lot more than I am into what goes on between those two.

(shrug) I don't buy it myself.

>>And just let him keep busting down doors and slaughtering people until
>>he got there? Maybe that kind of law enforcement strategy flies on
>>Zardon, but in New Avalon we tend to try and stop killing
>>sprees, no matter who's getting killed.
>
>Nice...was that a quote for the Comet?

It could be. It actually reads more like something Brass would say, if suitably irritated by a reporter, even though if you asked him personally, he'd probably say Big Fire guys getting cacked was all good. :)

(It's 'Cornet', btw, like the horn. Can be hard to tell in some fonts, I know. :)

>>Heh. Sara noticed that too, but wasn't really in a position to follow
>>it up. It might not've been what Gris was trying to imply with his
>>wording, but it sure sounded like it to her.
>
>Talk about enigmatic wording...

Hmm, yeah, it is pretty awkward, isn't it. What I mean is, Grissom's wording in that scene gave Sara the impression that, by pointing out to Depew that she wasn't a warrior, Gris was implying that he himself was one - which struck Sara as a very weird thing for him to be saying. On the other hand, his phrasing was ambiguous enough that that might not have been what he was trying to say, and Sara knows him well enough by now to know that trying to get him to explain it after the fact would be an exercise in frustration.

As Sara's life already contains sufficient exercises in frustration, she let it drop. At least in public.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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Adyen
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Apr-01-04, 05:23 PM (EST)
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43. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #42
 
   >Separate developments. The Repo Men and McCandless's people are
>basically setup for future developments, and they're operating within
>a pretty standard Symphony space-action story (though after I'm
>done with it, I'm going to try and move the Symphony away from
>space action and back to something closer to its roots for Symphony
>No. 5
).

You've already started with that, I'm sure most people has noticed. XD

Though it's kinda sad, I think. I was just reading SoS 2, the whole Nights of the Tenth's World (Hmmm... I wonder if a few years from now, people will start thinking SoS is the 'real' story instead of what actually happened like some people and fanfics? XP) part, and when I got to the Coda where they made Nanami's grave, I couldn't help but shiver, especially knowing what happened in Sympathy for the Devil...


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goldenfire
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Apr-01-04, 05:34 PM (EST)
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44. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #43
 
   >(Hmmm... I wonder if a few years from now,
>people will start thinking SoS is the 'real' story instead of what
>actually happened like some people and fanfics? XP)

While I acknowledge that SotS is, in no way, Canon to RGU....frankly I prefer it. This is probably at least partly due to the fact that I didn't see any Utena until AFTER having read a good portion of SotS. The flavor of the two interpretations (if the original can, indeed, be called an 'interpretation') is very different, and I much prefer SotS' version.

Similar, I suppose, to the way I prefer Tenchi OAV continuity to Tenchi TV... and again, it's the OAVs I saw first... 's probably a trend, but I don't have enough data points to sayfor sure, yet :)



==Jeremy
And who exactly is this diabolical 'they' to which we keep referring? If there's some grand conspiracy going on, the right hand doesn't appear to know what the left is doing. --Raziel (Soul Reaver II)


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Bad Moon
Member since Dec-17-02
290 posts
Apr-01-04, 06:59 PM (EST)
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45. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #42
 
   >
>>>Heh. Sara noticed that too, but wasn't really in a position to follow
>>>it up. It might not've been what Gris was trying to imply with his
>>>wording, but it sure sounded like it to her.
>>
>>Talk about enigmatic wording...
>
>Hmm, yeah, it is pretty awkward, isn't it. What I mean is, Grissom's
>wording in that scene gave Sara the impression that, by pointing out
>to Depew that she wasn't a warrior, Gris was implying that he himself
>was one - which struck Sara as a very weird thing for him to be
>saying. On the other hand, his phrasing was ambiguous enough that
>that might not have been what he was trying to say, and Sara
>knows him well enough by now to know that trying to get him to explain
>it after the fact would be an exercise in frustration.
>
>As Sara's life already contains sufficient exercises in frustration,
>she let it drop. At least in public.

I agree that what Grissom said had some high class ambiguity, but what struck me was how Grissom seemed to refer to his own weapon. Like "Yeah, those are some nasty gun's you have there, but you do NOT want to know what I carry around for self defense." Put Grissom in a whole new light for me.

------
Jon Helscher

Leo: (July 23—Aug. 22)
Your credulity will be stretched to the limit by the circumstances under which only you can control the giant robot.


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Gryphonadmin
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19238 posts
Apr-01-04, 07:37 PM (EST)
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46. "RE: CSI in the Sphere - my third re-read"
In response to message #45
 
   >I agree that what Grissom said had some high class ambiguity, but what
>struck me was how Grissom seemed to refer to his own weapon. Like
>"Yeah, those are some nasty gun's you have there, but you do NOT want
>to know what I carry around for self defense." Put Grissom in a whole
>new light for me.

Oh, I see. No, nothing special there. Grissom carries the standard-issue CSI sidearm, a compact conventional semiautomatic pistol fitted with a Petrarca XD magazine. (This enables any ammunition expenditures by the investigators to be immediately tracked by the central control system back at Headquarters. The Zardon Department of Justice uses a similar system with the Judges' Lawgiver sidearms.)

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor in Chief, Netadmin
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/


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MoonEyes
Member since Jun-29-03
740 posts
Apr-04-04, 06:53 PM (EST)
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49. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #0
 
   From one thing to another, and something that I haven't found anyone else ask about...seeing the 'higher-upper' in Big Fire's name, what have you got against Don Quixote? :)

...!
Stoke Mandeville, Esq & The Victorian Ballsmiths
"Nobody Want Verdigris-Covered Balls!"


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Mephronmoderator
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Apr-05-04, 01:55 AM (EST)
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50. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #49
 
   >From one thing to another, and something that I haven't found anyone
>else ask about...seeing the 'higher-upper' in Big Fire's name, what
>have you got against Don Quixote? :)

Actually, that's canon for the source material, Giant Robo. In that series, one of the Magnificent Ten is Dazzling Cervantes. We just gave him an apropos first name, and set him loose.

--
Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
"I find your lack of clue disturbing."


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MoonEyes
Member since Jun-29-03
740 posts
Apr-08-04, 12:30 PM (EST)
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51. "RE: CSI: New Avalon - Locard's Exchange"
In response to message #50
 
   >Actually, that's canon for the source material, Giant Robo. In that
>series, one of the Magnificent Ten is Dazzling Cervantes. We just
>gave him an apropos first name, and set him loose.
>
>--
>Geoff Depew - Darth Mephron
>Haberdasher to Androids, Dark Lord of Sith Tech Support.
>"I find your lack of clue disturbing."

Ah. Well, that would explain it. I have seen very little to nothing of the anime source material. Living in Sweden tend to limit you, in that. I just enjoy very well-written stories, when that show.

...!
Stoke Mandeville, Esq & The Victorian Ballsmiths
"Nobody Want Verdigris-Covered Balls!"


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