Starting another new one to avoid the Dread High Post-count Disease.

Some things in life must be savored appropriately.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

『アタシ - Atashi』Mori Calliope (Cover)

From the previous thread:

>That three camera setup is fine for everyday stuff, but it glitches
>out *constantly*, just look at Fillian and Zentreya's streams, and
>they have actual suits.
>
>That's not nearly good enough for proper 3D collabs and ESPECIALLY not
>good enough for a concert. Even Fillian, when she did the vtuber
>awards show, actually went to a studio to do it.

So I looked up Zentreya's youtube, rapidly decided I couldn't stand her or her content, found Fillian's and was also not enthused, but found a video that wasn't full of jumpcuts, and then later ran into another one where she was collabing with Dokibird and watched a bit of it...

... The demo videos of AprilTag hybrid setups I've seen look better than hers is? I don't actually know which specific glitches you're talking about. The 'vibrating' effect I don't think you can blame on the tracking, since you get that in 3D animation systems that don't involve that at all, if they don't smooth out their animation inputs or if somehow they've got faces of two objects perfectly overlapping and the engine can't decide which to display (not that I've ever done that). Can't really blame the cloth or hair issues on it either, because fuck hair and cloth simulation forever they aren't tracked, it's all on the animation engine.

But the basic lower body movement seemed way less prone to sudden jerks, even with only a single camera tracking the AprilTags.

And again I'm still not saying it's the be-all end-all of 3d tracking (though I'm pretty sure it could be pushed further than the videos I've watched did), but it's kind of an excluded middle thing? Not everyone wants to do concerts, I assume.

Though one idea I have seen put forward is that if you're just making the kind of content I personally like to watch, it's just kind of pointless and you can get everything you need using simpler apps with less technical overhead.

-IA.

(received information not interpretable)

RE Zentreya and Fillian's youtubes; they're almost entirely Twitch streamers, so anything on Youtube that isn't just straight VODs (Which I don't think either of them post?) is almost certainly going to be chopped up and edited. That's just the nature of Twitch streamers, unfortunately. Now, Fillian's 3D is objectively worse than Zen's, it's true. I don't know how much of that is because she's just so much more active and hyper, or what, but she very much has that 'Slightly upgraded VRChat' vibe going on.

You can also check out Snuffy, and....dammit, I keep forgetting her name. She's the 3D vtuber who's been around forever...CODEMIKO! And of course Projekt Melody.

Though CodeMiko may not be entirely fair, she seems to have put many monies into her setup over the years. She's got *movie* studio quality 3D going on.

>And of course Projekt Melody.

Mel has a new 3D model debuting next weekend (on both sides), though I don't think she's updating her actual mocap rig, so it's a little tangential to the actual discussion. I just felt like noting it.

Meanwhile, I reckon Bae's birthday concert, which just streamed, is a good example of the kind of 3D performance that just can't come out of a home rig at this point on the tech curve. Admittedly, Cover's big shows are on a different level in terms of overall production value, not just the performance mocap, but still, that's a big part of it.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Okay, yeah, that's definitely impressive. (Once I found some bits that weren't swinging the camera around too much to try and judge the tracking.)

The part where I find myself really wondering how it compares is how well the face tracking holds up at the same time as the... call it 'directionally complex' movement. Don't know how hard that part would be to pull off. It was surprisingly simple to get going when I messed around with it a while back, but I wasn't getting up to anything particularly vigorous either. (Wouldn't have been enough room in the space my computer was in, for one thing.)

Maybe once I can get my computer set up where I want it here, I'll do some experimenting, see how far I can push the 'random gear I've got lying around' route. But that's going to take getting some electrical work done first.

-IA.

(and doing something else with all the boxes of random that are in the way)

>Meanwhile, I reckon
>Bae's birthday concert, which just streamed, is a good example of the kind
>of 3D performance that just can't come out of a home rig at this point
>on the tech curve. Admittedly, Cover's big shows are on a different
>level in terms of overall production value, not just the performance
>mocap, but still, that's a big part of it.

The technology's so great, it was able to replicate the sound of a tea kettle when our rat got a birthday message from her favorite VA.

LAST EDITED ON Feb-29-24 AT 04:00 AM (EST)
 
See also Kronii's hip movements here, and This concert video from Choco and Mel(Not that one, Hololive's)

I don't know exactly how they do the concerts - if the girls are actually on premises, or in the studio live for the live portions of the concert or if it's all prerecorded beforehand (parts are obviously recorded, that's always been clear) but I suspect the live parts are actually live.

Meanwhile, you can compare this 3d collab Korone and Marine had three months ago. ....I'm using this because the last one was closer to three years old.

EDIT: I just realized that I'm talking about venues like they regularly have actual live physical concerts. What I SHOULD have said was live in studio for the concert. Some songs are very much prerecorded, particularly, I think, the group songs? Just from the simple logistics of not having to have six to ten talents ready to pop in in the seconds between songs.

Cover is definitely pumping a lot into their tech at every level. Here's a particularly subtle but important example, from A-chan's new model debut: Watch how the cloth reacts as the zipper goes down, I don't think that kind of modeling was available outside of Hollywood CGI until recently (or at all), and certainly not on-demand on a live model (at least, it appeared to be a live model and not pre-rendered).

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

So after running into someone asking "How do Kronii's clothes work?"*, it got me wondering how they piece everything together when forming a new generation?

For example, take Advent- obviously they did Fuwamoco's character designs after hiring the talents because you'd need to do something special to take advantage of them being twins (and making characters siblings in lore without a RL relationship is not a great idea**). But when did they decide on the unit lore, i.e. being jail-breakers? And did they do character lore and design for the rest before hiring talents, entirely afterward, or do a rough first and then tune it to the talent afterward?

It would be especially interesting to hear about this for Myth, since according to things I've heard from Gura and others, they were basically handed files and told "this is your character". But I'm also under the impression that the talents are supposed to more-or-less match their avatars in height in order to make the 3d stuff work, especially for group productions, so did they just fish (pun intended) for a short gremlin to be Gura?

*Short answer: it doesn't. Long answer, the white part of her top is 3 separate pieces (collar, bikini top, and corset) which are basically impossible to tuck together and have it fit properly IRL. Then there's the black halter bit, which doesn't come down below the widest part of the breast, so it would just pop off the moment she moved.

**In lore, Selen and Elira were half-sisters, and look at how well that didn't work out.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Well, They did make the outfits for display during a HoloFes - they made everyone's outfits that year~

As for the lore setups and character designs, that's long been a question people have had. I think the general thought I've seen is that they're handed the base design and are allowed to make requests for tweaks to the design like color, hair styles, accessories, and have some say over their personal lore, but less over the wave lore.

LAST EDITED ON Feb-29-24 AT 11:50 PM (EST)
 
>Well, They did make the outfits for display during a HoloFes - they made
>everyone's outfits that year~
>
>As for the lore setups and character designs, that's long been a
>question people have had. I think the general thought I've seen is
>that they're handed the base design and are allowed to make requests
>for tweaks to the design like color, hair styles, accessories, and
>have some say over their personal lore, but less over the wave lore.

At least half the lore these days starts with the fans and the mems just going "Yeah, let's go with that." Or started as spur-of-the-moment events that fans never let the mems live down. Like how a one-time mispronunciation of a name by Subaru led to the man at the top of it all being dubbed "YAGOO."

Thats different from the stated official lore. Thats...ill call it "Organic lore". It is an important thing for character growth so they aren't just static, I think. :3

>Thats different from the stated official lore. Thats...ill call it
>"Organic lore". It is an important thing for character growth so they
>aren't just static, I think. :3

True, I like to think of the official lore as being the grain of sand around which grows a pearl or the "organic lore." The characters become their own people and the fans come to love them...but the flip side is rewatching the debut streams a year later is an act of self-torture.

That's partly why some of the HoloGra episodes feel so weird; they're sometimes more closely based on the Official Lore(tm) which can often clash with the Organic Lore.

Most of the broad strokes are already there and they try to match applied talents to the designs they have. And if a design goes long enough without finding any talents, it can get retired.

After a talent is matched, they'll do final rigging adjustment for heights within reason, and let the talents weigh in on some character setting stuff that isn't hard set already like last names. It should also be noted that there's still some level of kayfabe here, especially with gens before about 2021. A very easily established example is that Coco's stated height didn't match her real height (she's not that tall). You can also see the mismatch between Ina's heights when she finally got to show up in 3D.

Incidentally, Cover seems to have coalesced upon a pretty solid formula by now for piecing together a new generation as a whole (at least for the English side). They're looking for one superstar to carry the gen early while everyone is finding their feet, they'll take one or two other people with a lot of experience to be stable, then they'll try and grab diamonds in the rough who by their metrics could be very successful but just need a fresh start or hololive's bigger platform to explode. They also at this point have a pretty good handle on having harmonious generations with relatively little interpersonal drama.

>Incidentally, Cover seems to have coalesced upon a pretty solid
>formula by now for piecing together a new generation as a whole (at
>least for the English side). They're looking for one superstar to
>carry the gen early while everyone is finding their feet, they'll take
>one or two other people with a lot of experience to be stable, then
>they'll try and grab diamonds in the rough who by their metrics could
>be very successful but just need a fresh start or hololive's bigger
>platform to explode. They also at this point have a pretty good handle
>on having harmonious generations with relatively little interpersonal
>drama.

And here I thought the HoloEN formula was to find one charming leader (Mori/Kronii/Nerissa), one cinnamon roll (Gura/Mumei/Bijou), one gremlin (Ame/Bae/Shiori), one quiet bookworm (Ina/Fauna/Fuwawa), and one excitable motormouth (Kiara/Sana/Mococo).

No, I didn't forget IRys, she just wasn't originally part of Holo Council. Hence why she falls into her own unique category: "Yabai idol."

So basically it's a Sentai team, is what you're saying.

-IA.

(received information not interpretable)

The YabaIdol has long been a thing in Hololive; Yozora Mel, Houshou Marine, Uruha Rushia, Hoshimachi Suisei. Haachama. it's just that IRyS is like, so platonically perfect, she's like the Official Kilogram of YabaIdolness :3

>The YabaIdol has long been a thing in Hololive; Yozora Mel, Houshou
>Marine, Uruha Rushia, Hoshimachi Suisei. Haachama. it's just
>that IRyS is like, so platonically perfect, she's like the Official
>Kilogram of YabaIdolness :3

And every day, Yagoo's dream gets further away.../s

>And here I thought the HoloEN formula was to find one charming leader
>(Mori/Kronii/Nerissa), one cinnamon roll (Gura/Mumei/Bijou), one
>gremlin (Ame/Bae/Shiori), one quiet bookworm (Ina/Fauna/Fuwawa), and
>one excitable motormouth (Kiara/Sana/Mococo).

I think you may have Advent's cinnamon roll and gremlin reversed. :)

--G.
I suppose a case could also be made for Mococo as cinnamon roll
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

I'd probably go with Bijou and Shiori both being gremlins and Mococo being the cinnamon roll.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

I don't know if I'd classify Fuwawa as "quiet" in any way. She doesn't instigate things, but she's certainly always in the mix. If anything, I'd put Shiori in your "bookworm" slot, not just for lore reasons, but also like with Ina and Fauna, she's good at dropping a showstopper into the conversation (granted Ina just drops puns, and Shiori drops things that make you question your sanity, but hey).

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

LAST EDITED ON Mar-01-24 AT 08:12 AM (EST)
 
edited to fix markup.

>Most of the broad strokes are already there and they try to match
>applied talents to the designs they have. And if a design goes long
>enough without finding any talents,
>it can get retired.

Wow, that almost looks like a prototype Nerissa.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

New chapter of Yamato Phantasia is up.

So Mamarissa made her long-awaited debut Friday night and seems to have charmed the pants off the jailbirds who tuned in. One of the highlights of the stream was a special guest appearance by Biboo and...well..you'll just have to watch the clip. Fair warning, keep insulin handy to avoid sudden diabetic coma.

The best part was when Mamarissa said that she didn't think many people were going to show for it, and they only got thirty-seven . . . thousand.

Other highlights for me were "Nerissa being a quiet kid until she stole the mic from Malpha",
"Nerissa biting her sisters for taking things", and
"Aradia being confirmed as the problem child".

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

>So Mamarissa made her long-awaited debut Friday night and seems to
>have charmed the pants off the jailbirds who tuned in.

Say this for Nerissa, she's brave. If I were someone whose day-to-day life depended on people not knowing who I really am, the last person I would have as a guest star on one of my streams is my mother. I'd be too anxious about the inevitable real-name drop to function.

>Fair warning, keep insulin handy to avoid sudden diabetic coma.

Just as an aside, because I've had to train up on this stuff pretty extensively over the past year and it's now become one of my Standard Misconception Peeves: Insulin's function is to reduce blood glucose, and it's hypoglycemia that causes the classic* diabetic coma. If you're diabetic and you go into a hypo coma, you forgot to eat and/or got your calibration wrong and took too much insulin.

--G.
* There are less common forms of diabetic coma that are associated with hyperglycemia, but they're caused by complications of long-term super-high blood glucose levels and the accompanying dehydration; there's nothing sudden about those.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

>Say this for Nerissa, she's brave. If I were someone whose day-to-day
>life depended on people not knowing who I really am, the
>last person I would have as a guest star on one of my streams
>is my mother. I'd be too anxious about the inevitable real-name drop
>to function.

True, even in the clip, you can hear Mamarissa hesitate for a fraction of a second when saying Nerissa's name. Then again, the family as a whole has spent so much time involved with Nerissa'a channel that she might be in danger one day of her mother addressing her as such in public instead.

>Just as an aside, because I've had to train up on this stuff pretty
>extensively over the past year and it's now become one of my Standard
>Misconception Peeves: Insulin's function is to reduce blood glucose,
>and it's hypoglycemia that causes the classic* diabetic coma.
>If you're diabetic and you go into a hypo coma, you forgot to eat
>and/or got your calibration wrong and took too much insulin.
>
>--G.
>* There are less common forms of diabetic coma that
>are associated with hyperglycemia, but they're caused by
>complications of long-term super-high blood glucose levels and the
>accompanying dehydration; there's nothing sudden about those.

Was a small, "I've been on the internet too long" joke. Diabetes is endemic in my family tree, including a great-aunt who had lifelong type-1 and passed away a few years ago after slipping into a coma due to a hypoglycemic episode. I still remember witnessing a woman trying to treat her own diabetic son for a hypoglycemic episode at a grocery store by putting cake frosting atop a candy bar.

LAST EDITED ON Mar-04-24 AT 11:57 AM (EST) by Gryphon (admin)
 
Animator Terrible Joe decided to make his own HoloGra episode for FuwaMoco, and it's an absolute riot.

Doesn't do anything to help Fuwawa beat the allegations though.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

You gotta strip the 'Http://' part out of a link. This is what you want~

I thought I had, sorry about that.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

She can't stream it, but Kronii has just revealed that she's playing Disco Elysium on her own time. Holy cow. The images.

--G.
the Cuno doesn't effin' care
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

LAST EDITED ON Mar-08-24 AT 03:45 PM (EST)
 
Enormous SAO fan Aqua got added to SAO Last Recollection

Screenshot preview of the update:
i.redd.it/aj0v7scvjwmc1.jpeg
(edited to kill embed)

LAST EDITED ON Mar-08-24 AT 03:46 PM (EST)
 
Hey, could you perhaps remove the screenshot embed? Not the shot itself, just the embed. It's stretching the forum horizontally.

EDIT: Thank you!

And video of Aqua reacting to her in-game scenes.

As a followup to her wildly successful series of commission drawing streams, Calli will be doing some voice clips for viewers tonight starting at 9 PM Eastern.

Here are the rules of engagement, quoted directly from the video description:

Rules for commissioning voiced lines:
0. Pink and red superchats get a voice line of your choice!
1. Absolutely no NSFW
2. Light fanservice is OK! But I will draw the line if there's something uncomfortable and reserve the right to edit the line to my comfort level. Also these will be done PUBLICLY so keep that in mind!
3. I will not say anything that would make other members or people in general feel uncomfortable. This includes name-calling beyond jokey things like "dummy" or "loser." I also won't say things that are purposefully incendiary, or just outright rude unless it is very clearly in jest. I'd also prefer to leave mentions of other members out of these lines! Use common sense! (example: Mori, please say "I wish ____ and ____ would collab!")
Impersonating characters / character voices is FINE!
4. No addresses, no full names, no phone numbers, that's weird.
5. I'll say lines from movies and games, but it can't include the names of very obviously copyrighted characters, because I'm accepting money for these. (ex: It's a me, a Mario." In fact, just avoid Nintendo and Disney completely.)
6. The entire line must fit inside 1 pink superchat.
7. I'll read a referenced text up to 200 words long if a red superchat is sent, but it has to be very clear where I can find it. (ex: Mori, please read the first 200 words of "Full Life Consequences" by Squirrel King).
8. I RESERVE THE RIGHT TO SKIP ANY LINE SENT TO ME WITHOUT ANY EXPLANATION AT ALL.
So please, please use common sense!! I will know if you are up to funny business right away and not even acknowledge you sent a message and you will not get a refund! This is the only warning I will give you!

All lines will be recorded with my good mic (Manley Reference Mic) and sent as a WAV in a large zip folder of all lines recorded, and it'll be saved under YOUR USERNAME!
I will upload them at the end of the stream! We will also be doing these very quickly!

Great examples of what you could order:
Birthday message for a friend, tongue twister, ambiguous line from a piece of media you like, inside joke between you and your friends, good luck wish to a friend, voice line for your passion project, just something you'd want to hear Mori say, shout outs, memes, etc.!

For those of you who may be unfamiliar with how these things work on YouTube, pink and red are the colors of US$50 and US$100 superchats (stream donations) respectively. You'll need to have your YouTube account set up with a way to pay for supers beforehand. The window of opportunity for getting one in will be way too small to allow for setting it up in the process of sending the super itself, because:

She'll be doing it like she did the drawing streams, i.e., turning on supers for only a few seconds at the beginning of the stream. Otherwise, she'd get what happened to Mumei when she did a commission stream and left supers open for a full minute, namely more than 400 things to draw.

So if you've got a good idea for something you'd like a pink reaper to say, the gelt to spare, a payment method for superchats already set up, a good sense of timing, and a bit of luck, well, your chance is approaching! This has been a public service announcement.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Over/under on the number of deadbeats who'll pay $50 just to hear her say "Ara ara"?

“Ay ar ay ay ar ay”

I'm gonna go with "enough that she will wish she'd put a 'no ara ara' rule in the rules ahead of time".

She's probably going to get the uwu magic a bunch too.

Now I wish I had the money on hand, I'd do "I'm the very model of a modern major general".

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Considering how she slew Rap God, I don't think she'd have much trouble with that. :3

Yeah, I didn't think she'd have trouble with it, per se, I just thought it would be funny to hear.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

>She's probably going to get the uwu magic a bunch too.

Y'know... I try, I really do, to just let people like what they like... but this thing makes me regret the invention of microprocessors.

--G.
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

I don't disagree with your assessment, but 1) it's a Hololive tradition at this point, and 2) Calli is openly asking people to throw stupid shit at her.

If nothing else, the original guy who started the meme (Mayuzumi) puts his money where his mouth is, firing off $50+ superchats* to get the girls to do it. So far though, Kronii is immune.

*apparently Biboo gave in for just $10, but she's the meme-lord, so she probably wanted to do it.

"I'm in your walls"
"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Kronii has pride. Too much one might even say. :3 Biboo is the waves Gremlin, she'd probably have done it for free. Like another gremlin did a lifetime ago with another uwu shitpost.

rawr, Ecks three nuzzles! Pounces on you uwu you're so warm...

Kronii's pride, and the falls therefrom, are a big part of her charm I think. The other half is how she turns into a sadistic little goblin in any sort of competitive multiplayer games. Plus she's packing charisma at all times, even when failing. Also GWAK!

(Can you tell I'm a Kronii simp? Granted, she was my entry into vtubers, so . . .)

As far as the "uwu magic" goes, I don't think the guy really expected to get her to do it on the first try, though that was quite a lot of money to get her to talk down to him, when she would've certainly done it for free.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

LAST EDITED ON Mar-08-24 AT 08:45 PM (EST)
 
>GWAK

"THERE'S A BIG-ASS SPIDER ON THE CEILIIIING"

>that was quite a lot of
>money to get her to talk down to him, when she would've certainly done
>it for free.

I am reminded of the Calli ASMR stream in which someone asked her to insult chat in a spine-tingly voice, and she escalated straight to a threat within about five words, possibly out of an innate inability to tell the difference. :)

I know I've seen someone else refuse the uwu thing, but I can't remember who. Whoever it was wasn't forewarned like Kronii, but instead got a couple of words into it, then trailed to a confused halt and mumbled something along the lines of, "What the... hell is... ? No, I'm not sayin' that. Moving on..."

--G.
that might have been Calli, come to think of it
-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

A quick search didn't give me anybody refusing after starting or Calli doing it one way or another, but I did find a bunch of the ID branch torturing Kronii with uwu-speak in general.

Including Kaela, oddly enough.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

And speaking of Mayuzumi, he showed up in the Kronii and Sally chatting stream to try to get her to do the uwu magic.

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

>And speaking of Mayuzumi, he showed up in the Kronii and Sally
>chatting stream to try to get her to do the uwu magic.

... aber natürlich.

--G.
In the immortal words of that quintessential thespian Wesley Snipes, "Some motherfucker's always trying to ice-skate uphill."

-><-
Benjamin D. Hutchins, Co-Founder, Editor-in-Chief, & Forum Mod
Eyrie Productions, Unlimited http://www.eyrie-productions.com/
zgryphon at that email service Google has
Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

His persistence is . . . admirable, I suppose. For her part, Kronii just went "Sally, don't look at that."

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."

Also, I'm just now noticing how packed tonight is, with overlapping streams that I'd like to be there for- we have Nerissa with Bao, which is about as close as I think any of the Holo EN girls will get to a "lewdtubing" stream, then there's Kronii with her RL best friend "Sally", and the aforementioned Calli stream.

Spoiled for choice, indeed! (or a bunch of vods to watch later).

"This is probably a stupid question, but . . ."